Blakes7 March 2001

blakes7@lists.lysator.liu.se

96 participants
1067 discussions

Re: Re [B7L] Random Killfiling
by Bizarro7＠aol.com 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

In a message dated 3/8/01 7:53:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, littles(a)lycos.co.uk writes: << Leah wrote: > In a message dated 3/8/01 8:27:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, Shame writes:<< >Evidently you can't spell. Or else that was a Freudian slip.< It was a typo. But if the shoe fits, by all means... >>Vague threats? It was a statement.<< Whatever you intended, it was a moot point. Some of the most skilled slash artists was chosen by some of the actors to illustrate their books, video cover art, etc. So much for censure. :) >> What are you on about? A few people have mentioned a dispute in the early nineties in which slash artwork played a big role. But I don't care about that. I wasn't even _in_ fandom then; why should I? As usual, Leah, you've misunderstood completely.<< So very typical of you, Shane. If you've never been affected by something, and have little or no actual knowledge of the facts concerning the issue, you "don't care." That's called deliberately flaunting your ignorance. The topic here was the reprehensible presence of adult fan art, either from my pen or anywhere on the Ashton Press website. The answer is that there never were any repercussions from adult fanfic or fan art, and no dire warnings from you or anyone else will bring about a sense of trepidation. In short, you're wasting your time, and probably annoying some of the many fans present who do write, read or otherwise enjoy adult fanfic and art. >> The explicit artwork to which I was referring was at http://hometown.aol.com/pelkiepet/socomfort.htm. I would assume that the zine itself contains somewhat more of same, would you care to confirm or deny this?<< BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! You actually think these pictures are 'explicit'? Everyone, PLEASE, I beg of you to go immediately to the above-referenced site and witness the horrible depravity of the pictures present, including the mock cover of the B7 "lurid romance novel" that everyone was having so much fun with on this list, a couple of years ago. And while you're there, make sure you see all the horrible references to MORE pornographic illustrations by me, blatantly stated on that web page! Cover the eyes of the young-uns! Lock up the horses! Oh my God, it's...it's...depravity! ROTFL! >>Were the actors aware of > all of it? Why yes, they were.<< >Why bring the actors into it? I didn't mention them, and you should maybe take a look at Archive Message #44056 on the subject. But since you do mention them, in the past two weeks, several people, both pro and anti slash, have spoken out on the Lyst about how they personally, or people they know, find such artwork distasteful, or about why such pictures can be upsetting, or even damaging, to the actors, their families and their careers (e.g. Julia in #44065, 2001-02-28 23:05, Neil in #44228, 2001-03-01 22:40).<< Distaste is not a basis for censorship. It's a motivation for avoidance of that which one finds distasteful. If they don't want to look at slash art or fiction, then they won't buy it or visit sites that feature it. End of conflict. As for damage to the actor's careers, well my oh my, you haven't visited the sites of some other fandoms lately, have you? Adult fanfic is actually the norm, rather than the exception. And some of the actors we are discussing have done far more damage to their own careers with poor decisions and behavior than any run of a fanzine could ever have dreamed of. They didn't need any help at all. No need to feel you've been appointed the official protector. Leah "Those who choose to ignore history are doomed to repeat it."

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Re: [B7L] Modes of engagement
by Bizarro7＠aol.com 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

In a message dated 3/8/01 5:38:07 PM Eastern Standard Time, N.Faulkner(a)tesco.net writes: << Keep on kicking the bastards once they're down...<< Calle, please note that this participant has now deteriorated into name-calling, when I have already disengaged. Thanks. Leah

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Re: [B7L] Slash
by Bizarro7＠aol.com 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

In a message dated 3/8/01 5:15:38 PM Eastern Standard Time, wilsonfisk2(a)yahoo.com writes: << > Is there any chance we could call this off topic as > it's becoming a > discussion of Robert's Rules of Order or similar and > take it to the spin > list or private mail?<< >Sorry, but with Annie continually pretending to not understand things, and asking questions she knows the answers to in order prevaricate further and excercise Mandy style 'spin', I thought some 'cutting through the c[deleted} had become neccesary. But it's time and space consuming for those not pretending/prevaricating, and e-mail is costly.< I had no idea you were having this debate with Annie. You appear to have me mistaken for another list member. Now here's the part where you contradict yourself by excusing your error on account of her being my 'cohort', even though she and I frequently don't see eye to eye. ROTFL! >>My apologies, Mrs Peel.<< I offer something a little more mature and responsible than apologies, Mrs Peel. I will terminate the discussion of this thread with Wilsonfisk because you politely requested it. Leah

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Re: [B7L] Slash and Random Killfiling
by Bizarro7＠aol.com 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

In a message dated 3/8/01 4:19:24 PM Eastern Standard Time, wilsonfisk2(a)yahoo.com writes: << Frustration? No. But then I have no vested interest in this discussion and no market to protect. >> What an odd comment, since I have never produced or sold a B7 adult zine in my life. Then again, if I had, thanks for the well-meant publicity. We all know that there is nothing inherently evil about marketing. Leah

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Antecedents of the Federation [was Re: Pornography]
by Harriet Monkhouse 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

Fiona wrote: >ObB7: I'd like to claim the presence of characters > named Dortmunn, Inga, Raiker, Dainer, Sonheim, >Leitz, Muller, Keller and Klyn as the evidence for >a possible German contribution to the founding of the Federation Interestingly (well, perhaps not), there have been a lot of German names turning up in young Australian cricket teams recently. Sorry, all these cricket references are probably my guilty conscience reminding me I haven't written up the Redemption match yet. Jarriet

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RE: [B7L] Blake and Inga
by Andrew Williams 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

Neil wrote: >And what was Uncle Ushton sent to Exbar for in the first place? Offensive body odour. Thread hijacking. Loitering at a bus stop with intent to catch a bus. Breaking & entering a hard-boiled egg....

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Re: Re [B7L] Random Killfiling
by Bizarro7＠aol.com 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

And Shane wrote: << < Frankly, Leah, at this point you're just shit-disturbing. You can killfile me if you like, but if you can judge a man by the quality of his enemies, well, I've had a look around Ashton Press' website and I've rung up some of my slash-reading friends, and I'd consider it an honour to be killfiled by a purveyor of sexually explicit fan art, which uses the likenesses of the principal B7 actors without their permission, with evidently no thought for the distress which it might cause them.<< If I wasn't laughing before, I am now. I invite anyone on this list to actually 'look' at the Ashton Press website, and find any sexually explicit fan art or slash fiction. The first thing you'll notice is Annie's statement that there will *be* no adult or slash fiction posted on her website, and there never has been. And at least make up some slash-reading friends who sound realistic, Shane. In the 30 years that I have been in media fandom, I have drawn literally hundreds of illos and cartoons...and never once have I drawn genitalia. This makes me, perhaps, the tamest of any B7 fan artist to be published in adult zines. As bombast goes, this deserves some kind of booby prize. Ooh! I said the word 'booby'! Call the actors! Leah

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Re: Re [B7L] Random Killfiling
by littles＠lycos.co.uk 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

Leah wrote: > In a message dated 3/8/01 8:27:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, Shame writes: Evidently you can't spell. Or else that was a Freudian slip. > > << Frankly, Leah, at this point you're just shit-disturbing. You can killfile > me if you like, but if you can judge a man by the quality of his enemies, > well, I've had a look around Ashton Press' website and I've rung up some of > my slash-reading friends, and I'd consider it an honour to be killfiled by a > purveyor of sexually explicit fan art, which uses the likenesses of the > principal B7 actors without their permission, with evidently no thought for > the distress which it might cause them.<< > > ROTFL!!! You're about a penny short and ten years too late to go around > waving vague threats at me. Vague threats? It was a statement. > The illustrations in question appeared in the > early 90's, in the midst of a fan dispute far more daunting than your > insignificant posturing, and there were no dire repercussions then. [why do I suddenly find myself picturing Giroc?--SL] There > were, in fact, no repercussions at all for ANY adult fan art, explicit, slash > or otherwise, that ever appeared in a B7 fanzine. What are you on about? A few people have mentioned a dispute in the early nineties in which slash artwork played a big role. But I don't care about that. I wasn't even _in_ fandom then; why should I? As usual, Leah, you've misunderstood completely. The explicit pictures which I saw appear at http://hometown.aol.com/pelkiepet/socomfort.htm. I would assume that the zine itself contains somewhat more of same, would you care to confirm or deny this? Ten years ago, there was no Internet, or not much of one anyway. Explicit fan art therefore must have had a fairly limited circulation, through snailmail and cons. Today, we have the Internet. Anybody who does a search for [insert character name]+art is going to come up against some pretty raunchy stuff. Which is why I said you should be careful-- not everybody finds fan porn acceptable, you know... >Were the actors aware of > all of it? Why yes, they were. Why bring the actors into it? I didn't mention them, and you should maybe take a look at Archive Message #44056 on the subject. But since you do mention them, in the past two weeks, several people, both pro and anti slash, have spoken out on the Lyst about how they personally, or people they know, find such artwork distasteful, or about why such pictures can be upsetting, or even damaging, to the actors, their families and their careers (e.g. Julia in #44065, 2001-02-28 23:05, Neil in #44228, 2001-03-01 22:40). >They said nothing Which doesn't necessarily indicate that they were happy about it. > I'd never killfile you. It's too much fun when it's this easy. Likewise. Shane "Avon, you were my only friend..." --Blake

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Re [B7L] Slash
by littles＠lycos.co.uk 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

Emma wrote: > Is there any chance we could call this off topic as it's becoming a > discussion of Robert's Rules of Order or similar and take it to the spin > list or private mail? No, don't, don't! This is fan_tas_tic! :) Shane "Avon, you were my only friend..." --Blake

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Re: [B7L] Kathryn's convention report/slash
by Tavia 09 Mar '01

09 Mar '01

Pat S wrote: >I disagree. I've just finished watching my copy of >"The Way Back" and Avon is rather conspicuous >by his absence!!!! Oh god, I'm really really sorry ... and I am just writing an Avon-only bit of fic. I'll put him back, promise. When I'm done. Tavia

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Blakes7 March 2001