On Thu, 1 Feb 2001 22:57:56 -0500 "Dana Shilling" dshilling@worldnet.att.net writes:
Helen said:
Okay, the Deliverance thread has expanded to misogynism in the
series as
a whole and the accusation has been thrown that Servalan is
insane.
She has some sociopathic tendencies. A sociopath essentially understands right and wrong, it just doesn't matter. However, there's debate (so I understand) about whether they're insane. True sociopaths have been known to act in ways where the profit-loss just doesn't add up (the sociopath who stole the credit cards of his pro bono defense attornies while they were defending him) that suggests a lack of ability to make essential judgements. Anyhow, Servalan's not that far gone. She may have hubris, ego, and overconfidence, but you can follow the math behind her calculations.
This also ties in with the "Was Avon a crimo" question (to which I'd say the answer has to be "No"--a crimo is a "criminally insane" person, the polar case perhaps being Hannibal Lecter. Stealing a lot of money doesn't rank as admirable behavior, but it's eminently sane.
True enough. However, about the question raised earlier about why crimos weren't made into mutoids, a crimo's advantage over a mutoid is intellect - and genius seems to be one of their two common characteristics (gender, too, but let's not get into that. Having worked with Servalan, maybe Travis felt more secure around male killers). However, it seems likely they've been conditioned in some way or Travis wouldn't be able to make use of them.
Beer goggles, more like--I'd say that because she finds Avon attractive, she overestimates the degree of similarity between them.
Eep. I know I've heard this before but never quite phrased that way. Servalan thought Avon was a borderline sociopath with murderous impulses. And she _liked_ him for it.
Can I change my vote on the insanity issue?
Not that
any of us would do anything like that.
Well, not unless we were _right_.
Although I think I have more in common Snow White.
(Episode Blake if it had been done by Disney
Blake [singing]: I'm wishing
Wishing Well Echo: I'm wishing
Blake: For the one I loath To find me
WWE: To find me
Blake: Today
WWE: Today
Blake: I'm thinking
WWE: I'm thinking
Blake: When he comes my way Of the snide things
WWE: The Snide things
Blake: He'll say
Avon: Want an apple, dearie?)
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Ellynne wrote:
On Thu, 1 Feb 2001 22:57:56 -0500 "Dana Shilling" dshilling@worldnet.att.net writes:
Helen said:
Okay, the Deliverance thread has expanded to misogynism in the
series as
a whole and the accusation has been thrown that Servalan is
insane.
She has some sociopathic tendencies. A sociopath essentially understands right and wrong, it just doesn't matter. However, there's debate (so I understand) about whether they're insane. True sociopaths have been known to act in ways where the profit-loss just doesn't add up (the sociopath who stole the credit cards of his pro bono defense attornies while they were defending him) that suggests a lack of ability to make essential judgements. Anyhow, Servalan's not that far gone. She may have hubris, ego, and overconfidence, but you can follow the math behind her calculations.
I personally always think that Servalan is completely sane, and that her murderous behaviour has been trained into her by the brutal society in which she lives; bit like Travis' argument in 'Trial'. If Servalan had been living in a comfy western liberal democracy she would be a substantially different person. OK, she has some loopy impulses, but it's mainly that the environment she has been trained and lives in encourages those to some degree.
Una
Una McCormack wrote:
I personally always think that Servalan is completely sane, and that her murderous behaviour has been trained into her by the brutal society in which she lives; bit like Travis' argument in 'Trial'. If Servalan had been living in a comfy western liberal democracy she would be a substantially different person. OK, she has some loopy impulses, but it's mainly that the environment she has been trained and lives in encourages those to some degree.
I agree. If Travis is the ultimate Federation Soldier, Servalan is the ultimate Federation Politician, playing the game better than most people in her society. In said comfy western liberal democracy, she might be the head of a big cooperation and wouldn't care a bit if whatever her firm is producing is poisoning the environment, but she wouldn't necessarily assassinate anyone in order to sell the product.
So, without scrupels? Definitely. Evil? Sure. But insane? No.
Tanja
"Ellynne G." wrote:
True enough. However, about the question raised earlier about why crimos weren't made into mutoids, a crimo's advantage over a mutoid is intellect
- and genius seems to be one of their two common characteristics
I'm always puzzled by the assertion that crimos are super-intelligent. The actual text is:
MOLOK: Show me the ship; I must learn about it. CALLY: You're a crimo, aren't you? MOLOK: I have a high intelligence quotient, but I enjoy inflicting pain -- in that I am a true crimo. So don't be stupid, do as I say. Show me the flight deck.
The use of the word _but_, coupled with the actor's delivery, leads me to believe that Molok's intent is to say 'just because I'm a crimo, don't make the mistake of thinking I'm stupid.' IOW, that crimos are generally considered to be _un_intelligent.
Mistral
Mistral wrote:
I'm always puzzled by the assertion that crimos are super-intelligent. The actual text is: <snip>
I agree that Hostage implies that Crimo's are generally a bit thick. (The fight scenes in Hostage seem to bear this out). Unlike Cally of course who can deduce that a Federation employee is a criminal psychopath just by looking at him. Perhaps he was oozing bad vibes. Or perhaps his eyes were too close together.
I would like to like Hostage, I love the bit with Servalan and Joban. Unfortunately it just annoys me. Who commissioned Allan Prior anyway ?
Stephen.
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