Fiona:
I once asked him if he saw any of the gay subtext in B7 which many fans say they do. He replied that he detected no sexual tension *at all* between Blake and Avon. Now,before you say "but the actors weren't gay, so of course he didn't," this doesn't always read.
This could of course be bad acting. I detected no sexual (or any other) tension between Anna and Avon, but put that down to poor acting or at least uninspired casting.
Tavia
----- Original Message ----- From: Tavia Chalcraft tavia@btinternet.com To: 'Lysator mailing list' blakes7@lists.lysator.liu.se Sent: Thursday, February 22, 2001 1:05 AM Subject: Re: [B7L] Sally-speak
Fiona:
I once asked him if he saw any of the gay subtext in B7 which many fans say they do. He replied that he detected no sexual tension *at all* between Blake and Avon. Now,before you say "but the actors weren't gay, so of course he didn't," this doesn't always read.
This could of course be bad acting. I detected no sexual (or any other) tension between Anna and Avon, but put that down to poor acting or at
least
uninspired casting.
It could :). But the thing is, it's conveyed in other ways. Avon is seen in bed with Anna. They talk about love. They embrace when they meet. He cradles her in his arms. She says "When I was with you I was always Anna." I think you'd have to work hard to deny that there's an implied hetero/sexual relationship between Avon and Anna. My gay friend is, I think, just as attuned to behavioural cues as to "Chemistry," and still didn't see any way of reading B and A's relationship as sexual, even taking the "bad acting" argument into account (which I don't see. PD and GT are at *least* as good actors as Scott Fredericks, who as I've said successfully pulled off playing a character as bisexual despite being straight).
Possible counterargument: "But you can't just come out and show two men in bed in 1970s TV!" Yes, but there are other ways of doing it which make it clear that the relationship between the men is sexual. Egrorian calls Pinter his "golden-haired stripling" and tells about how they ran away together. Krantor langorously offers Toise an--aphrodisiac--pateki-cake. In another series, Willow and Tara hold hands, are seen moving into a flat together (while Tara complains that she thinks Willow's friends are uncomfortable about them living together) and the sexual subtext of the scenes where they cast spells are pretty obvious-- you don't have to have lesbian-dar of any sort to realise what is being implied.
My point is, if the writers/actors/whoever had intended the characters to read as gay/involved, they could have done so. But they didn't.
Fiona
The Posthumous Memoirs of Secretary Rontane Available for public perusal at http://nyder.r67.net
_________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com
"Tavia" == Tavia Chalcraft tavia@btinternet.com writes:
This could of course be bad acting. I detected no sexual (or any other) tension between Anna and Avon, but put that down to poor acting or at least uninspired casting.
If you attended Iain's "Acting lessons from B7 and B5" workshop, you got to see an alternatively acted version of Anna's death scene, with me as Anna and Una as Avon.
On 26 Feb 2001, Calle Dybedahl wrote:
"Tavia" == Tavia Chalcraft tavia@btinternet.com writes:
This could of course be bad acting. I detected no sexual (or any other) tension between Anna and Avon, but put that down to poor acting or at least uninspired casting.
If you attended Iain's "Acting lessons from B7 and B5" workshop, you got to see an alternatively acted version of Anna's death scene, with me as Anna and Una as Avon.
Which was, quite honestly, vastly better than the original. That wasn't entirely unexpected -- it is one of the worst-performed scenes in the series -- but even so I was quite stunned by the fact that two apparently miscast actors, with (as far as I know) no formal acting training at all, with no warning, not knowing the lines, trying to perform with scripts in their hands, managed to produce a tender, touching and subtle performance that nearly brought a tear to my cynical old eye. I'm not sure I'll ever be able to watch that episode again.
Iain
On 27 Feb 2001 as I do recall, Iain Coleman wrote:
On 26 Feb 2001, Calle Dybedahl wrote:
> "Tavia" == Tavia Chalcraft tavia@btinternet.com writes:
This could of course be bad acting. I detected no sexual (or any other) tension between Anna and Avon, but put that down to poor acting or at least uninspired casting.
If you attended Iain's "Acting lessons from B7 and B5" workshop, you got to see an alternatively acted version of Anna's death scene, with me as Anna and Una as Avon.
Which was, quite honestly, vastly better than the original. That wasn't entirely unexpected -- it is one of the worst-performed scenes in the series --
I've been observing this discussion with increasing puzzlement, until the explanation suddenly dawned on me that I have apparently been interpreting the famous cellar scene completely differently from everybody else. (Which would explain why the fan-fiction stories I've encountered on this subject have all rung so utterly false to me, of course.)
Yes, both parties to this exchange are stilted and awkward. I thought that was the point.
In another post on this subject, Fiona Moore states:
But the thing is, [sexual tension]'s conveyed in other ways. Avon is seen in bed with Anna. They talk about love. They embrace when they meet.
But the way I remember it, (and I'm working from memory here, I haven't seen this episode since I was researching 'Not to Know' in August 1999) the embrace is entirely one-sided. She rushes up to Avon, flings her arms around him, kisses him and starts prattling in a nervous, rushed way, as if she is trying to distract him, while Avon freezes up, totally failing to respond.
Yes, both parties to this exchange are stilted and awkward. I thought that was the point.
Exactly. I have never understood why so many have gone on and on about a lack of chemistry when I have always thought this was a particularly appropriate playing of an amazingly surreal event for both of them. I can't imagine Avon acting in any other way. What are people expecting from this sort of encounter?
to give him no time to question the version of events he
had been fed, that he had always believed.
This is how I viewed it as well.
Behind the apparently numb facade, Avon's mind is evidently racing away, analysing the unbelievable as he stares at her. He is wary and taken aback, first by her apparent resurrection and then by her off-balance behaviour. He knows something is wrong almost from the start.
Well, okay, might as well just say this is a me too post and get it over with. :)
-
Calle Dybedahl -
Fiona Moore -
Harriet Bazley -
huh -
Iain Coleman -
Tavia Chalcraft