Debbie wrote: <Hello, can we please discuss Blake's 7?>
Hey, I tried to start a discussion on Slave, but for some unknown reason no one showed any interest ...
Okay, some possible thoughts? (Not very brilliant, but it's early in the morning).
***********************
What *does* everyone do on the flight deck? We know Jenna does the piloting, Vila usually handles weaponry (whose idea was that, BTW <g>?) and either Cally or Gan seems to handle communications. But what does Avon (before he runs for the force wall <g>) and whichever's *not* on communications do during a battle? They do all seem awfully busy ... *****************
Thinking about some of my favourite politicians (I believe there's an elecion going on in the UK at the minute? Hands up anyone who'd be tempted to vote for Secretary Rontane :-)), I'm wondering what other people's mental picture of the Federation's ruling group is. We have very little to go by (as usual), but what we have is rather fascinating: Bercol and Rontane and their scheming, Joban (one of the good things about Voice from the Past - wonder if he survived Servie's coup?) and the bit of information he gives us about Servalan's appointment. Then there's Chesku and Anna ... and would anyone agree with me that the Chairman in Shadow *might* also be a member of the President's clique? (And that Durkim followed Servalan's breif triumph to become part of *her* court?)
The amount of scheming and backstabbing that goes on is very Roman to me (as in I Claudius, most of whose characters would fit beeeutifully into Servalan's world IMO), even though I see the Federation as a whole as more Stalinist. There's also a flavour (for me) of decay, especially in the 4th series, that clashes with the canonical fact that the Federation *is* in Pylene-driven resurgence and makes me believe that said resurgence is probably due to collapse soon with or without Our Heroes' intervention. ******************
For the Avon fans - I know there's a few of us around - just what *is* it about him that you find makes him that much more interesting? (And no fair pointing to the leather :-)) ******************
How experienced a guerilla do you think Cally was before joining the crew? Her comments when watching Blake in Duel indicate some experience in this type of fighting (though, not having *any* myself, I don't know how right she is); are there any other indications (leaving aside the lack-of-camoflague gear she chooses in Bounty)? ******************
And for the more frivolous among us (and having recently been given tickets to the stage version of Singing in the Rain) what price Don Lockwood (Gene Kelly) as either Avon or Travis and Lina Lamont (Jean Hagan) as Servalan? (And anyone for seeing Vila do "Make 'Em Laugh?")
Anyone with any better suggestions feel free ...
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In message F87yfogkJXrRjbDt3Hv00005731@hotmail.com, Sally Manton smanton@hotmail.com writes
For the Avon fans - I know there's a few of us around - just what *is* it about him that you find makes him that much more interesting? (And no fair pointing to the leather :-))
Scientist as (anti)hero.
Sally asked:
For the Avon fans - I know there's a few of us around - just what *is* it
about
him that you find makes him that much more interesting? (And no fair
pointing to
the leather :-))
and Julia replied:
Scientist as (anti)hero.
Although PD could get it disastrously wrong when he had a Big Moment of Drammer to handle, I think he's usually spot-on with zingers. I think it's a terrific charm performance--sort of No Weddings, Lots of Funerals.
-(Y)
Sally Manton wrote:
I'm wondering what other people's mental picture of the Federation's ruling group is.
Loved your "I, Claudius" comparison, Sally (more about that in a moment). "Stalinist" also sounds fitting. My personal picture, though, would be Orwellian (i.e. no personality cult, and even the opponents are by and large a construct of the ruling party), or, alternatingly, the Byzantine Empire.
The amount of scheming and backstabbing that goes on is very Roman to me (as in I Claudius, most of whose characters would fit beeeutifully into Servalan's world IMO),
Absolutely. Livia would have ruled the Federation behind the scenes, setting up someone a bit more stable than Travis to do the military work for her. Bercol & Rontane would probably have been her sidekicks. Since she was much more patient than Servalan, and since her plots usually suceeded, she'd have gotten hold of Blake & Co. very early on and we would never have gotten the show.
There's also a flavour (for me) of decay, especially in the 4th
series, that clashes with the canonical fact that the Federation *is* in Pylene-driven resurgence and makes me believe that said resurgence is probably due to collapse soon with or without Our Heroes' intervention.
I know what you mean about the flavour of decadence, which is why I chose the Byzantine Empire, because during the Julian-Claudian dynasty, Rome actually was still on the rise, not in its decadent stage. Never mind Caligula's mad shenanigans, the infrastructure and the administration were still sound, and the Empire hadn't even reached its largest extension yet. Though... in the year of the Three Emperors, following Nero's suicide, we do have an atmosphere very like the Federation following Servalan's coup d'etat, with general after general going for the throne. However, with Vespasian finally installed, everything stabilised again. So, alternatingly, could it be that the Federation after a final major shake-up becomes even more, not less stable?
Tanja
Tanja wrote:
The amount of scheming and backstabbing that goes on is very Roman
to me (as
in I Claudius, most of whose characters would fit beeeutifully into Servalan's world IMO),
Absolutely. Livia would have ruled the Federation behind the scenes, setting up someone a bit more stable than Travis to do the military work for her. Bercol & Rontane would probably have been her sidekicks. Since she was much more patient than Servalan, and since her plots usually suceeded, she'd have gotten hold of Blake & Co. very early on and we would never have gotten the show.
Talking of whitewashes, I'd better put in a word for the historical Livia, who may quite possibly have been a loyal wife and not a murdering type at all. Tacitus's take on the Augustus/Livia/Tiberius death-and-succession thing seems to be coloured by the slightly better attested Claudius/Agrippina/Nero case.
Servalan, of course, was a hardworking and principled administrator, too.
Sally said:
And for the more frivolous among us (and having recently been given
tickets
to the stage version of Singing in the Rain) what price Don Lockwood (Gene Kelly) as either Avon or Travis and Lina Lamont (Jean Hagan) as Servalan? (And anyone for seeing Vila do "Make 'Em Laugh?")
One of Gene Kelly's great roles was as Joey Evans in Pal Joey--I'd like to see a version of THAT with Gene Kelly as Tarrant and Vivian Segal as Servalan. And I'm afraid Jean Hagan is already playing Piri (Assassin) in Singin' in the Rain.
I'd kinda like to see Blake slurping through puddles and swinging around lampposts in "Rebellin' in the Rain" though (and the number ends when Travis comes out and glowers at him?)
-(Y)
--- Sally Manton wrote:
Thinking about some of my favourite politicians (I believe there's an elecion going on in the UK at the minute? Hands up anyone who'd be tempted to vote for Secretary Rontane :-)), I'm wondering what other people's mental picture of the Federation's ruling group is. We have very little to go by (as usual), but what we have is rather fascinating: Bercol and Rontane and their scheming, Joban (one of the good things about Voice from the Past - wonder if he survived Servie's coup?)
A pedant writes: er, actually it was Hostage... My money is on Joban surviving and being part of the counter coup that overthrew Servalan (assuming that he wasn't Ardus)
and the bit of information he gives us about Servalan's appointment. Then there's Chesku and Anna ... and would anyone agree with me that the Chairman in Shadow *might* also be a member of the President's clique?
I rather like the idea of Servalan purging the old regime but losing her nerve when it comes to the head of the Terra Nostra. Dastor: With respect Madam, *no-one* purges the Terra Nostra.
(And that Durkim followed Servalan's breif triumph to become part of *her* court?)
If there was any justice in the world...Oh I suppose not. Actually I suspect that Durkim would have gone as he knew the truth about that transmission from the Liberator. The official line would probably have been:
Blake, in collusion with the renegade Travis, today shut down the Federation's defences and let in an Andromedan attack....I can't see Servalan letting Blake claim to be saviour of the galaxy and she'd have to explain the presence of the Liberator on the front line somehow.
The amount of scheming and backstabbing that goes on is very Roman to me (as in I Claudius, most of whose characters would fit beeeutifully into Servalan's world IMO)
Oh yes....Brian Blessed can act, now why didn't he do that in Cygnus Alpha. Livia (as has been suggested) as a cleverer version of Servalan. Or Servalan as Sejanus in drag ? Jarriere as Claudius anyone ?
For the Avon fans - I know there's a few of us around - just what *is* it about him that you find makes him that much more interesting? (And no fair pointing to the leather :-))
He gets the best lines for one thing :) I like the moral ambiguity that hovers around him. I didn't like season 4 Avon, mainly because he was much less interesting. I prefered the idea of someone who was essentially amoral but kept finding himself doing the right thing anyway. (As far as leather is concerned I always preferred Jenna :))
Stephen.
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Stephen said:
Blake, in collusion with the renegade Travis, today shut down the Federation's defences and let in an Andromedan attack....I can't see Servalan letting Blake claim to be saviour of the galaxy and she'd have to explain the presence of the Liberator on the front line somehow.
Why? Either she can say "DSV...I don't see any DSV, do YOU?" or identify it as the experimental Federation warship Conformity.
Oh yes....Brian Blessed can act, now why didn't he do that in Cygnus Alpha. Livia (as has been suggested) as a cleverer version of Servalan. Or Servalan as Sejanus in drag ? Jarriere as Claudius anyone ?
G-g-g-gosh!
-(Y)
Stephen said:
Oh yes....Brian Blessed can act, now why didn't he do that in Cygnus Alpha.
Because they didn't made him shave off his beard? Might there be a mysterious connection between that and overacting, as opposed to his good and beardless performance as Augustus?
Livia (as has been suggested) as
a cleverer version of Servalan. Or Servalan as Sejanus in drag ?
Either fits. I can just see Servalan in the scene where Sejanus, all joviality, intimidates Claudius into marrying his sister. Odd thought: Patrick Stewart as a male (as had been originally planned? Servalan on B7?
Jarriere as Claudius anyone ?
Nah. Wrong group, but to me, Vila is the obvious Claudius choice.
Bayban the Butcher as Caligula? Of course Krantor & Toise would at least fit Caligula's court.
Travis as Tiberius?
Tanja
--- angria wrote:
Either fits. I can just see Servalan in the scene where Sejanus, all joviality, intimidates Claudius into marrying his sister. Odd thought: Patrick Stewart as a male (as had been originally planned? Servalan on B7?
Not remotely odd. Of course he'd have to have a series of pretty young female officers on his staff :)
Jarriere as Claudius anyone ?
Nah. Wrong group, but to me, Vila is the obvious Claudius choice.
With Blake as his dear brother Germanicus.
Bayban the Butcher as Caligula?
I don't think Caligula would have lasted long in the B7 Universe. Possibly one of the more thuggish military emperors - Maximian for example.
Of course Krantor & Toise would at least fit Caligula's court.
Actually with Krantor's aesthetic sense I see him as being somewhere on a sliding scale between Hadrian and Nero. Much nastier than Hadrian and saner than Nero.
Travis as Tiberius?
Very definitely. Both disillusioned conservatives. Someone (I think Tacitus) quotes Tiberius as quoting a Greek epigraph to the effect that after him the world could end in fire. I think Travis would recognise a kindred spirit there. Would that make Maryatt the Drusus figure in Travis' life ?
Stephen.
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I wrote
Nah. Wrong group, but to me, Vila is the obvious Claudius choice.
Then Stephen Date wrote:
With Blake as his dear brother Germanicus.
Which makes Avon Herod Agrippa?
me:
Bayban the Butcher as Caligula?
Stephen:
I don't think Caligula would have lasted long in the B7 Universe.
Oh, I don't know, he survived Sejanus and Tiberius at his most paranoid while all his siblings and his mother perished. (Of course, as Livia points out, part of the reason was Tiberius wanted to have a successor less popular than himself, but still...)
Also, Bayban didn't last that long, either.
Travis as Tiberius?
Very definitely. Both disillusioned conservatives. Someone (I think Tacitus) quotes Tiberius as quoting a Greek epigraph to the effect that after him the world could end in fire. I think Travis would recognise a kindred spirit there. Would that make Maryatt the Drusus figure in Travis' life ?
Yes! With the letter scene mirrored in the "he saved my life" scene from "Deliverance".
Tanja
Angria@t-online.de (angria) wrote:
I wrote
Nah. Wrong group, but to me, Vila is the obvious Claudius choice.
Then Stephen Date wrote:
With Blake as his dear brother Germanicus.
Which makes Avon Herod Agrippa?
me:
Bayban the Butcher as Caligula?
Stephen:
I don't think Caligula would have lasted long in the B7 Universe.
Oh, I don't know, he survived Sejanus and Tiberius at his most paranoid while all his siblings and his mother perished. (Of course, as Livia points out, part of the reason was Tiberius wanted to have a successor less popular than himself, but still...)
Also, Bayban didn't last that long, either.
Travis as Tiberius?
Very definitely. Both disillusioned conservatives. Someone (I think Tacitus) quotes Tiberius as quoting a Greek epigraph to the effect that after him the world could end in fire. I think Travis would recognise a kindred spirit there. Would that make Maryatt the Drusus figure in Travis' life ?
Yes! With the letter scene mirrored in the "he saved my life" scene from "Deliverance".
Tanja
But where would Orac fit in (I think Avon might like Marcus Aurelius' Meditations)
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jacquispeel@netscape.net wrote:
But where would Orac fit in
The Sibyl, of course.
- Lisa
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