Blakes7 February 2001

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80 participants
929 discussions

Freedom of Speech in the Federation (was Thread Hijacking)
by Betty Ragan 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

Responding to me, Una McCormack wrote: > > I would certainly think so. But I do wonder to what extent the > > Federation attempts to preserve an illusion that freedom of speech > > exists... > > I'd say very little. I don't see the Federation as being as subtle as that, I > suppose. I think they *are* fairly subtle in some ways. Certainly, as we see in TWB, they apparently try very hard to preserve the illusion of a fair justice system. I think freedom of speech might well be a different issue, though. It's very easy to put a spin on the issue that says "Those dangerous subversives shouldn't be allowed to corrupt the minds of our children with their misguided ideas" or something like that. -- Betty Ragan ** ragan(a)sdc.org ** http://www.sdc.org/~ragan/ "The truth shall make ye fret." -- Terry Pratchett

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Re: [B7L] Re:Deliverance/H/C
by Marian de Haan 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

Neil gives examples of h/c stories: >"There was a Time When..." by Robin F Atkins (Horizon #?),< >"In The Wake of Ruin" by Linda Willard (I think) in another Horizon zine,< >"Alone and Silent" by Kathryn Cutmore (another Horizon offering),< I enjoyed those stories hugely, but I never realised they classify as h/c, which shows what an innocent I am :-) Actually, "In the Wake of Ruin" is my favourite PGP story, if only because it really gets Avon off the hook for killing Blake <veg>. Marian

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Books and Movies
by Dana Shilling 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

I think it's an interesting commentary that one can watch all 52 episodes without being able to say for sure what they use for books--I think the typical fanfic solution is to refer to "book placques" and/or "datacubes." We know from canon that there are Walkman- like objects for playing music. I assume that there's some equivalent of movie theaters because of the advantages of public entertainments (and, from the government viewpoint, the greater ease of censoring the prints of a movie in X number of theaters than self-selected video rentals or downloads). Or is one reason to use suppressants to eliminate the need for popular entertainment--even bread and circuses? -(Y)

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Which United strip would they wear? [was Re: fandom]
by Harriet Monkhouse 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

Peter asked: >Is this related to the "Cally In Red" thing at all? >A touch of the David Mellor? An intriguing idea... The Auronar, sponsored by Vodafone? Avon, obviously, would wear the Black Strip of 1993, which Eric Cantona had on the evening he attacked the fascist. Soolin's jumpsuit was probably adapted from one of the grey strips that Fergie insisted on dumping halfway through a match because he thought they were having an adverse effect on the team's game. Harriere

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Tariel Cells
by Andrew Williams 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

Peter wrote: > The cells are never mentioned directly outside of the episode > "Orac" (that I can find with a quick search anyway) Tariel cells were mentioned in other episodes, such as Orbit (where Egrorian explains that Orac & the tachyon funnel will survive the shuttle crash due to the resilient nature of tariel cells & lyclinic plaques(?)). However, there is not much extra information that can be used to explain how they work. Perhaps the reference to Orac's carrier beam in Star One is a clue. Andrew. - - - - - "Tariel Inside" - - - - -

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Re: [B7L] What's Silly ?
by Harriet Monkhouse 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

Stephen asked: >What does and what does not spoil people's >watching of B7 ? As far as I am concerned >Vampire Sand is very silly I like vampire sand, as a concept at least, because it's really alien. It's aliens like the Ultras who I can't take seriously (however beautifully Sheelagh painted them). Like that Dr Who story, 4th doctor I think, where they were on a planet with an excess of vegetation and a shortage of metal, and they met an alien imprisoned in some tunnels who was basically a giant brain rolling about. Last time I saw it, on UK Gold, the announcer said something on the lines of "silliest alien ever"; I thought it was one of the most convincing aliens ever. Harriere

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Re: [B7L] Redemption (the Episode)
by Dana Shilling 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

Una said: > I'm sure I've blathered on about this before. 'Redemption' serves for me the > purpose that I think 'Animals' serves for many others: i.e. a scapegoat episode > for all the things in B7 which annoy me: cheapness, ham, crap aliens... There's a saying the US that a conservative is a liberal who has just been mugged...not that I've ever had my car stolen (I don't even know how to drive) but I'm sure I'd feel much more sympathy for The System if I had. -(Y)

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Re: [B7L] Re:intellectual debates on the list
by Ashton7＠aol.com 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

In a message dated 2/22/01 2:04:11 AM Eastern Standard Time, avona(a)jps.net writes: << Can't we agree to sometimes have different tastes? No one owns a topic or thread, serious or humourous, and I'm really surprised to hear what some of you have said. >> Yes, very succinctly put. That's all I was getting at. You (meaning a universal you) cannot *own* a thread on a public mailing list and if you think you can, you are setting yourself up to be annoyed...and disappointed. Not to mention the people who might get annoyed when you try to impose your vision of what the thread "should" be on them. Annie

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Re: [B7L] Hurt/comfort & S&M (Was: Deliverance/H/C)
by Tavia Chalcraft 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

Neil wrote about h/c: >I would define it as a story in which one >character, not necessarily Avon, is literally and physically hurt, and >markedly debilitated as a result, quite possibly to the point of complete >helplessness. he (usually he) is then sustained through the period of >debilitation by one (possibly more, but normally just one) other character. >This might be the entire recovery process, or might merely be until the >Liberator arrives to teleport the hapless duo to safety. The story ends >with a strengthened bridge of understanding between comfortee and comforter >(or indeed the building of such a bridge from scratch), mostly through the >comfortee's heightened acknowledgement of the comforter's worth. The story >is typically written from the comforter's POV. He or she can often (but by >no means all always) feel suspiciously like a rather ubiquitous woman who >goes by the name of Mary-something or other. As outlined here there are certainly some similarities with what I would understand by S&M (and please stop reading now if discussion of this is going to offend you). Let's take it as read that the event discussed is fully consensual and is between people who are not strangers. To me, the central feature of S&M is the relationship between the top and the bottom, in particular, trust from the bottom and responsibility from the top. An ideal scene will often try to push the limits of the bottom's trust. There's also usually two phases to an S&M scene, which correspond in an obvious fashion with hurt and comfort. In these regards, there are clear similarities with h/c. In h/c, the hurt is almost invariably inflicted by a third party or other agent. In S&M, the hurt and comfort are usually both dispensed by the same person. Psychologically, the two ideas seem completely different to me. In h/c, the hurt is out of control of either the comforter or the comfortee, and usually does real damage, which would be permanent, even fatal without the Liberator medical technology (and therein lies the angst potential). In S&M, nothing should *ever* be out of control. The hurt is usually reasonably trivial, short-lived and self-healing. While the top *nominally* controls the process, the bottom is really in control of what goes on (and I don't just mean what tends to be referred to as 'topping from the bottom'). In my opinion, this is such a key difference between the two areas that I get quite annoyed/upset by people who equate them, even though I can perceive some similarities. Another aspect that Neil mentioned in another post was ritual. I don't have his comment to hand but I think he was talking about the way the hurt/comfort stories evolve usually being relatively formulaic and comparing this with the ritual of the S&M scene. I don't see this myself. A perfectly good explanation for the formulaic nature of some h/c stories is bad (or at least unoriginal) writing. The ritual aspect of S&M exists (1) to heighten the experience of what might in other contexts be perceived as relatively trivial pain, and (2) to allow a top who's physically weaker than the bottom to exert enough control for the scene to work. I'm certainly one of those who sees sexual imagery in at least some h/c stories, and I've even referred to Blake & Avon h/c as a kind of 'poor man's slash'. I mean this in the sense that slash stories often use the sex almost as a plot device to develop an emotional relationship between the two characters, while the comfort fulfils this role in h/c stories. Tavia http://www.viragene.com/ PS: In another context, Fiona talked about a friend with a 'gay-dar'. In similar fashion, I possess an S&M-dar, and believe me, hurt/comfort doesn't activate it.

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Domes
by Dana Shilling 23 Feb '01

23 Feb '01

OK. Starting fresh, new thread, possibly serious discussion: 1. How big is a dome--would it be the equivalent of, e.g., a city block, The City of London, London, or England? I imagine it must be fairly small--in The Way Back, you can see the light bulb shining through the little bitty windows cut in the styrofoam, the way you can in a building as you walk past. 2. Which brings up the question of how many domes there are, and whether separate countries are still recognized-- i.e., I've made references to Englandome and Helveticadome but even if countries still exist there would probably be lots of domes per country. And the question of whether Blake is Welsh just because Gareth Thomas implies the continued existence of Wales. 3. How do people get around within a dome? I know that personal transportation has been banned, but I can't believe that domes are small enough to walk from one end to the other. I assume something like trams or commuter trains. 4. Are there subcategories in grades (Beta-2, Gamma-4)? That could be what Avon means by a "fifth-grade ignorant," but I assume he means that Vila dropped out of school or was expelled in the fifth grade... 5. Which brings up the question of whether the schools have "grades" or "forms," "high schools" or "comprehensives," "colleges" or "universities." -(Y)

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Blakes7 February 2001