Blakes7 January 2002

blakes7@lists.lysator.liu.se

60 participants
295 discussions

Re: [B7L] Re: Character ages
by Tavia 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

Natasa wrote: >This means that Blake was leading one of the most influential >rebel groups on Earth ('the only one that really meant something', as Foster >says) at the age of 27. This is rather young for a leader, isn't it? Yes, that bothered me too. I had supposed that Blake was a charismatic figurehead, while Foster or others were actually rather more important in the organisation than suggested in TWB. Tavia

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Re: Liberator's defenses
by Helen Krummenacker 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

I liked the suggestion Liberator's defense systems were Sopron based. It suggests Avon looked up to his brother Amiyak, like Sherlock to Mycroft.

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The London and the space battle
by jacquispeel＠netscape.net 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

Whether or not the London flies to Cygnus Alpha direct or by using 'point to point' navigation (which would explain why it was passing a planet) it is unlikely to have weaponry more serious than that needed to destroy an errant asteroid - and the Federation is unlikely to allow civilian ships to go *anywhere* near a space battle - especially when the military (and civilian) authorities are seemingly unaware of any conflicts overlapping into Federation territory? There may be another explanation - the 'battle' was an illusion created by Zen. Consider: The crew of the London are presented with what they recognise as a computer battle. Almost immediately their scanners are knocked out, while the total damage to the London appears to be fairly minimal. From 'Redemption' it appears that the System's ships can be 'that precise.' The London crew assume that the yet-unnamed Liberator has been damaged in the battle, yet it is operational as soon as a potential crew comes on board (although there is some time between supposed damage and first contact, which would allow the repair facilities to activate). So - could the whole battle be means for the Liberator to 'get more crew'? The Liberator could be programmed to do this as part of its self-repair mechanisms ('Damage? Repair it. No crew? Get more.') As for the defence mechanisms - could Zen be Sopron-based? The Sopron creature in Harvest of Kairos is certainly able to 'confuse computers.' The central brain in 'Ultraworld' could be another such creature: it acquires information, and Zen says 'information must be acquired not given.' This does not answer the question of 'why' the Liberator happened to encounter the London in particular (apart from 'otherwise no story'). Further to my comment on Ensor and the System. Ensor is probably close to 70: his son was probably born some time after the Tariel cells were developed. If Ensor was System-born the space station was probably being finished during his childhood (assuming the slaves/System population in general have lifespans similar to that of humans). Federation records of the System might refer only to the old system 'constant conflict between the three worlds, and costs of involvement excessive to gains' - it *would* want to acquire the System's space station and DSV production capacities if it became aware hat they existed.) But the Federation does not appear to be aware of Ultraworld, which must appropriate passing spaceships on a fairly regular basis. One reason why both Ensor and Avon might have left the System as children (apart from their families disagreeing with it for political reasons). The computer skills of both were evident in childhood and their families chose to withdraw them rather than have them turned into components of the central network. Jacqui -- __________________________________________________________________ Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/

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Re: [B7L] Geek hierachy
by Helen Atkins 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

Nicola, I just wanted you to know I loved the Vila emails. The truly frightening thing to me is that there are now more people that speak Klingon than Esperanto. If anyone ever needed confirmation that Esperanto is a dead horse, I think that's it. _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com

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RE: Re: [B7L] Geek hierachy
by jacquispeel＠netscape.net 23 Jan '02

23 Jan '02

"Helen Atkins" <selil66(a)hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Nicola, I just wanted you to know I loved the Vila emails. > >The truly frightening thing to me is that there are now more people that >speak Klingon than Esperanto. If anyone ever needed confirmation that >Esperanto is a dead horse, I think that's it. > > But the Pope speaks Esperanto. Jacqui -- __________________________________________________________________ Your favorite stores, helpful shopping tools and great gift ideas. Experience the convenience of buying online with Shop@Netscape! http://shopnow.netscape.com/ Get your own FREE, personal Netscape Mail account today at http://webmail.netscape.com/

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RE: Re: [B7L] Avon and the System
by Nicola Mody-Nikoloff 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

Tereth wrote: > > > But then Avon as doting dad or dad-to-be is a fanfic idea > I've seen done > > > soooooo very badly it may have turned me right off it > (Susan Matthew's > > > Shadowplay - yeccchhhh). > > > > Maybe not "doting" presicely but I think he'd be a > fairly good father. > > Maybe not the best dad in the universe, but fair. I doubt > very much he'd > > indanger a childs life for any reason. He would probably > arange things so > > that child and mother would wind up on Kaarn or someplace > like that. Safe > > and with people who have a fairly descent technological > level so that the > > child could if he or she wanted to could become a computer tech like > > himself. I wouldn't be surprised if that is exactly what happened on > > Terminal with Cally. He had the perfect opportunity to arrange their > (Cally and her unborn child) safe traval to Kaarn and took it. > Sounds plausably to me at any rate. > > > > Tereth Dragonstar I've seen something like that done somewhere in a series of stories (can't remember where - in Phoenix?). Cally is pregnant and she and Avon fake her death; she sneaks aboard Scorpio and escapes in one of the lifepods in suspended animation, but not to Kaarn. The last story has Avon and Vila some time after GP on another planet, finding a coin Avon gave her - one assumes she's there too. The serial stops at that point; I expected rather more. The fact you never see Cally's body and have to take Avon's word for it (as with Blake and Jenna) does give a nice opportunity, though Avon would have to have a good reason to lie to the others instead of enlisting their help. :-) Nico *** This e-mail is privileged and confidential. If you are not the intended recipient please delete the message and notify the sender. ***

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Fw: Re: [B7L] Avon and the System
by Tereth Dragonstar 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

> > > But then Avon as doting dad or dad-to-be is a fanfic idea I've seen done > > soooooo very badly it may have turned me right off it (Susan Matthew's > > Shadowplay - yeccchhhh). > > > > Maybe not "doting" presicely but I think he'd be a fairly good father. > Maybe not the best dad in the universe, but fair. I doubt very much he'd > indanger a childs life for any reason. He would probably arange things so > that child and mother would wind up on Kaarn or someplace like that. Safe > and with people who have a fairly descent technological level so that the > child could if he or she wanted to could become a computer tech like > himself. I wouldn't be surprised if that is exactly what happened on > Terminal with Cally. He had the perfect opportunity to arrange their (Cally > and her unborn child) safe traval to Kaarn and took it. Sounds plausably to > me at any rate. > > Tereth Dragonstar > Sorry for the cross post. I don't remember which list it was meant for. Tereth Dragonstar

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Re: Avon, Ensor and the System
by Betty Ragan 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

Anna Simpson wrote: > I think I have a list somewhere of what it can/cannot do > during the course of the programme I'd be *very* interested in seeing such a list, if you have it... -- Betty Ragan ** bragan(a)nrao.edu ** http://www.aoc.nrao.edu/~bragan Not speaking for my employers, officially or otherwise. "Seeing a rotten picture for the special effects is like eating a tough steak for the smothered onions..." -- Isaac Asimov

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AutoPost: Lyst Culture Guide
by kat＠katspace.com 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

Guide to Lyst Culture ********************** (written for the B7 mailing list at <http://lists.lysator.liu.se/mailman/listinfo/blakes7>) composed by Kathryn Andersen version 1.2 (25 September 2001) Considering the number of newbies who have admitted to being nearly frightened away by the manner of folks on this list, and wondering how much larger the number who *were* frightened away, it was deemed a good idea to write a Gentle Introduction which will lift confusion and humanise the apparently terrifying denizens of these electronic halls. If there be errors here, then send the corrections forthwith to the maintainer of this document. (See above) This is by no means meant to replace the actual Lyst FAQ (at <http://www.lysator.liu.se/~calle/b7list/FAQ.html>) but serve as an adjunct to it. This is *not* a rule-set of customs. It is *descriptive* not proscriptive. The actuality, not the ideal. The distillation of our understanding of what the Lyst is like, so that folks don't have to read a year's worth of posts in order to get an idea of what the heck is going on here... Also, if you're new to the net, you might find the following helpful - common E-Mail abbreviations <http://www.zeusprod.com/glossary/mailterm.html> - Netiquette (net etiquette) <http://dir.yahoo.com/Computers_and_Internet/Internet/Beginner_s_Guides/Neti…> - The Google Search Engine <http://www.google.com> which was used to find the above URLs... Lyst Culture In A Bottle ************************* What's this "Lyst" business? ============================= The mailing list <blakes7(a)lists.lysator.liu.se> was the first Blake's 7 (electronic) mailing list to be created (and it also predates the newsgroup). Note the "lysator" in the address. Since there are other lists (most notably, the Other List (see Lyst FAQ)), presumably to save having to say "the lysator List", a shorthand for that is simply "the Lyst". Our Esteemed Listowner, Calle, is not a woman. This doesn't stop people calling him "Cally", indeed, it would be almost irresistible not to, considering the subject of this List. Nobody outside his native country can actually pronounce his name correctly, but it may help those who want to try, to keep in mind that "Calle" comes from the same root as "Carl". Not only that, it's a common short form of Carl, in the same way that Dick is for Richard. Contrary to rumour, "lysator" does not mean "liberator" in Calle's native tongue. It apparently doesn't mean anything in particular. Posting Style ============== Unlike many other lists, we don't tend to be chatty, and off-topic posts are (after a while) encouraged to go to the Spin-off list, so that we can get down to the serious business of discussing the political systems in B7 or the nature of terrorism or how teleportation works; or the lighthearted business of Avon's red leather trousers or what kind of ice cream the particular characters would prefer, or how to recast the series. (Note: it seems that the instructions for subscribing to the Spin list are not in the Lyst FAQ. So here they are: TO POST: Send an e-mail to <b7spin(a)metva.com.au> TO SUBSCRIBE: Send an e-mail with a Subject line of 'subscribe' to <b7spin-request(a)metva.com.au>. TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Send an e-mail with a Subject line of 'unsubscribe' to <b7spin-request(a)metva.com.au>. ) It isn't a required custom on this list to introduce yourself, though a few people like to. People also don't tend to issue a formal welcome to newbies -- we just get on with the discussion and expect folks to join in (or not). Please don't consider this unfriendly; it's simply... focused. We're always interested in fresh ideas. If someone doesn't respond to your posting it could simply be because they agreed with it -- and didn't want to write a "me too" post. On the other hand, feel free to consider this unfriendly... but if you do, then it behooves you to go and welcome people, don't it? If the Lyst seems particularly busy and snarky, it's probably February. Odd Acronyms and Other Collections ================================== If you are confused by people referring to "the wrath of FINALACT" or suchlike, be confused no longer. As with many online fandoms, groups of like-minded fans often declare allegiance to their particular favourite characters, and form groups. Generally in order to be part of such a group... one simply declares oneself to be part of it. One doesn't have to be part of any group at all, and these groups are not meant to be taken deadly seriously either. Though some are more tongue-in-cheek than others. Often they are formed of those who consider their view to be a minority one. The following list is not intended to be exhaustive. The Tarrant Nostra ------------------ Yes, this one doesn't have odd acronyms but with such a cool name, who needs them? The first known reference to the Tarrant Nostra by that name is apparently in 1995, though the core group was around for longer than that. The name sprung from the mind of Brooke Barker. This group, is, obviously, those who favour Tarrant. Carol McCoy is "The Godmother" of the Tarrant Nostra; other members may not be so clearly identified. See also <http://www.tarrantnostra.com/> F.I.N.A.L.A.C.T. ---------------- This stands for "Foundation Invalidating Numerous Accusations Levelled At Croucher's Travis". These are the fans who prefer Brian Croucher's Travis, aka Travis II. They have a tendency to threaten detractors with The Comfy Chair, Karaoke music and Teletubby torture. Jacqueline Thijsen is the Chief Inquisitor. Penny Dreadful is their Queen, hopeful of being elevated to godhood, so that Iain Coleman can be Pope. See also <http://tezcatlipoca.algonet.se/cgi-bin/getbyid.pl?id=26736> G.I.T.H.O.G. ------------ This stands for "Greif Is Travis, House Of Greif". Byline -- 'In Time, We All Come to Greif'. These are the fans who prefer Stephen Grief's Travis, aka Travis I. They appear to be less active than FINALACT, probably because they don't perceive themselves to be in the minority. See also <http://tezcatlipoca.algonet.se/cgi-bin/getbyid.pl?id=33344> A.S.K.S. -------- Avon's Sympathetic Kindred Spirits go against the flow of Avon fans because they don't give a fig whether he looks sexy in black leather, they just identify with him. Kathryn Andersen made up this acronym, so she is presumably the founding member. Gareth's Gorillas ----------------- Fans who are into Gareth Thomas and his work, as distinct from just being interested in Blake (though they are interested in Blake too). Chief Gorilla is Judith Proctor. One may see them at cons wearing "Gareth's Gorilla" badges. Ironically, many of Gareths Gorillas don't actually have Blake as their favourite B7 character. The Gan Defence League ---------------------- Those who appreciate the unsung and oft under-appreciated Olag Gan. Judith Proctor goes around distributing oak leaves to those who stand up for Gan and say nice things about him. S.C.A.M. -------- Society for Crushing Animals Maligners, given a name by Una McCormack, the (almost) sole person who not only liked the episode "Animals", but strives to defend it. Dedicated to the art of Justinification (justifying Justin). Followers of the Goddess ------------------------ The concept of the Golden Goddess Soolin, her Acolyte Dayna, and the Chief Hairdresser Vila was the invention of Ophelia (aka Kanna-Ophelia, aka (name suppressed on request))... not quite as gone as we thought. Jarrigoths ---------- The Jarrigoths' aim is to over-run the universe, conquering all opponents with their battlecry of JOY (Jarriere! Oh Yes!). Their influence has been far-reaching; not only did they get Jarriere, a minor character who only appeared in one episode (Gambit... Travis called him a powder-puff) into the top 20 of an online poll of favourite SF characters.... but they actually persuaded a fannish model-maker to include Jarriere into their line of die-cast models (after Avon, Blake, Travis and Vila). They are led by Harriet Monkhouse, who, after another Harriet joined the Lyst in 2001, decided to style herself Jarriet (or Harriere) to cut down on possibilities of mistaken identity. Avon Without Guilt ------------------ Not a terribly active group these days, but Pat Nussman founded "AWG" -- Avon Without Guilt. As in, "Yes, we *know* it's terribly common; we *know* that more discerning tastes move on from their first attraction to the Dark and Snarly One in favor of the more arcane delights of, oh, The Thaarn and Bruce The Spider; we *know* he has a less than stellar character. So what? We still love him, and we refuse to be guilty about it." It is worthwhile noting that Barbara Paul dedicated one of her novels to the Avon Without Guilt group. See <http://www.barbarapaul.com/holland.html> Sickly Equines =============== Certain topics have a habit of coming up over and over again. I'm reluctant to call them dead horses, because it can be the case that a newbie can actually offer new insight that nobody's thought of before, and pass the hand of healing over what was once assumed to be a corpse. - Hey, Maybe Avon Shot Blake's Clone! - Was Blake a Freedom Fighter Or A Terrorist? Should Blake Have Destroyed Star One? - Avon Was Mad (No He Wasn't) - Was Travis only following orders? Hot Topics ========== One topic which is pretty much guaranteed to start the fires burning no matter how nicely and calmly people may start the discussion, is slash. If you don't know what slash is, don't worry, since you probably don't want to argue about it either. An oldish summary of the pro-slash position from Susan Beth can be found somewhere on the lysator ftp site, I think, maybe. <ftp://ftp.lysator.liu.se/pub/blake7/> A summary of the anti-slash position is at <http://www.katspace.com/b7/slashsum.html> Another topic which tends to set the sparks flying is Horizon, the biggest and oldest B7 fan club. Or, more specifically, its Coodinator/Treasurer/etc, Diane Gies. I'm not going to reiterate it here, that would just stir people up again. Any topic can raise the temperature if it is pursued obnoxiously enough. There has been steam coming out of ears over - whether Deliverance is Sexist - posting style - con reports - religion just to name a few. But don't let that scare you off, we're generally quite calm and rational... Signs that a thread has gone on too long at too high a temperature are - posters start repeating themselves (worst case, reposting earlier posts of their own) - postings degenerate into a "he said, she said" dissection of why what so-and-so said was insulting. INTJ? MBTI? Huh? ================== Once upon a time, someone first brought up the idea of figuring out the Myers-Briggs (personality) Type Indicator for each of the characters. It was mentioned briefly once before, but the topic truly exploded in February 1998 when Adam Fuller posted this -- <http://tezcatlipoca.algonet.se/cgi-bin/getbyid.pl?id=21161> Much discussion ensued, and many people went off to <http://www.keirsey.com> to take the personality tests there to figure out their own type. Of those who took the tests and actually reported back, the majority appeared to be either INTJ or INTP types (and, oddly enough, the consensus was that Avon was either an INTJ or an INTP). This probably explains why the posting style of the list appears so unfriendly -- half of us are closet Avons. Some people are sick of this topic. Others remain fascinated by it. Penguins? What's that got to do with B7? ========================================= The connection between penguins and B7 can only be explained by the one who discovered the sinister conspiracy in the first place. For some reason, Calle seems to think it was Una McCormack, but the rest of the world blames it on Neil Faulkner. <http://homepages.tesco.net/~N.Faulkner/blakes7/darkheart/darkheart.htm> Except for Neil, who blames it on Alison Page. Acknowledgements ================ Thanks (in no particular order) to Penny Dreadful, Calle Dybedahl, Neil Faulkner, Una McCormack, Tavia, Mistral, Steve Rogerson, Ophelia, Andrew Williams, Sandra Kisner, M, Harriet Monkhouse, Jacqueline Thijsen, Wildean, Harriet, Carol McCoy, Susan Beth, Tiger M, Sandra Kisner, Carolyn, DDJ, Helen Atkins for additions, comments and corrections. Where To Find It ================ This FAQ-ish thing can be found on the web at <http://www.katspace.com/b7/lyst.html> and posted on the Lyst once a month. Wed Jan 23 01:06:01 EST 2002

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Re: [B7L] Re: Character ages
by Ellynne G. 22 Jan '02

22 Jan '02

Dayna - I'll normally agree 20, although I may yet put together a story in which she's Lauren's younger half-sister and lies about her age and place of birth because she knows how Federation humans feel about racial purity, which would make her younger (and, in which case, Hal Melanby's older daughter died on Earth but under circumstances where he can still pass of Dayna as her older sister, a protection if he ever encounters Federation personnel). Avon - 70-90. OK, I'm trying to put together a story in which Avon isn't human and where he's survived partly by managing to make himself look _older_ than he would naturally to disguise how he _isn't_ aging. It explains the cantankerousness and why he doesn't like getting close to people or be involved in high profile events that will make keeping a low profile a decade later that much harder. Ellynne ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/web/.

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Blakes7 January 2002