Blakes7

blakes7@lists.lysator.liu.se

5511 discussions

Re: [B7L] decentring morality
by Mac4781＠aol.com 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

Natasha wrote: > On GP, Blake still relies on his ability to > intuit others, probably more than he relies on any computer. That's not what we're told in the episode. We're told that he's lost that ability and he knows he's lost it. BLAKE: Where did you get that gun? ARLEN: I won it in a lottery. What do you care? BLAKE: I don't, so long as it wasn't issued to you. ARLEN: It's Federation. BLAKE: That's what I mean. ARLEN: Do I look like one of theirs? BLAKE: I can't really tell anymore. As if Boucher wanted to make sure the audience understood that point, he repeats it later: ARLEN: Your friend Blake said he couldn't tell anymore who was Federation and who wasn't. He was right. He couldn't. Another indication of Blake's singularly focused mindset is his belief that Tarrant's passing the test makes everything all right. Passing his test is the be all and end all for Blake: someone passes the test and he can relax his guard. It's Arlen who has to point out that it's not a good idea to let Tarrant run loose. I've never said Blake didn't have reason to become the man we saw on Gauda Prime. They were all stressed beyond human endurance. This isn't an attack on Blake. It's an attempt to understand what Chris Boucher intended when he wrote the script. And specifically, why he mentioned an eyepatch just like Travis' in the script notes. Carol

1 0

Re: [B7L] decentring morality
by Natasa Tucev 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

Carol wrote: <In Blake's own words (and I'm sure you're familiar with his zealous delivery): DEVA: These stupid games you insist on playing, Blake, will get someone killed eventually. BLAKE: I have to test each one myself. Blake goes on to admit that Deva could do the testing via computer, but he still won't let go of the need to test them himself. Blake's inability to sway from a course that he recognizes to be dangerous and unnecessary suggests a "person with excessive attachment to an activity," which is one of my dictionary's definitions of a fanatic.> No, I don't think it makes him fanatical. Blake's friends in the Freedom Party were massacred because of a traitor; Bran Foster's people were massacred because of a traitor; so were Avalon's people. Blake may have witnessed even more betrayals and gory scenes in the span of time between Star One and GP. He is forming a new group now and as usual, he takes the whole burden of responsibility for it. He's the leader; if anything should happen to these people it would be his fault. Blake's guilt complex is a trait well established in the series. Another well established trait is Blake's capacity to see through people. I'm always fascinated by the speed with which he finds Ro's weak point and starts shaking his certainties. On GP, Blake still relies on his ability to intuit others, probably more than he relies on any computer. This ability has diminished, however, along with his clear 'moral vision'. Blake's desperate need for certainty here, just like Avon's 'in the end, winning is the only safety', again remind me of Derrida. At any rate, this need doesn't make one fanatical; it's only natural in a universe characterized by chaos and disorder. One's psyche can hardly be in a different condition. N.

1 0

Fwd: Re: Re: [B7L] decentring morality
by Sally Manton 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

After I wrote: <after all, Tarrant didn't trust him either; they're neither of them that stupid).> Dana wrote: <It's at times like this I'm grateful the United States has a Fifth Amendment> Does the Fifth Amendment cover when we can hear you *thinking* it at the top of your mental voice? :-) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

2 1

Fwd: [B7L] Re: Avon and Gan (was Dinosaurs)
by Sally Manton 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

Helen wrote: <Wouldn't it have been something if Gan had made it to third season, and Anna was also his woman?> Wildly unlikely coincidence being after all an integral tool of fiction ... I still think they should've made Del and Dev Tarrant relatives. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

2 1

Re: [B7L] decentring morality, correction
by Mac4781＠aol.com 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

> That he was idealistic doesn't rule out that he was also fatalistic. I was speeding out my reply so quickly that my brain ended up three thoughts ahead of my fingers. That should read: "That he was idealistic doesn't rule out that he was also a fanatic. Carol

1 0

Re: [B7L] decentring morality
by Mac4781＠aol.com 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

Sally wrote: > Blake is *not* fanatical here, he's fatalistic, and jaded and more > detached ("doing relatively decent things for relatively decent reasons"). We'll have to agree to disagree on this (example of Blake's fanaticism below). > But as Boucher said himself "he was idealistic enough to be taken in by the > girl," to stop her killing Tarrant rather than letting him escape - and to > trust that Avon would hear him out. That he was idealistic doesn't rule out that he was also fatalistic. > As with the fact that it was Avon pulling the trigger ("I wanted > to shoot him in the back, but they wouldn't let me") it was possibly > something over which the author had limited control - (bearing in mid that > the actor's memories may be as subject to scrutiny as the writer's, of > course, but given that it was Gareth's demand for Blake to die, it makes > sense.) I don't understand what you're saying here. Yes, Chris knew Gareth wanted Blake to die. And Chris apparently agreed that Avon could be the one to shoot him (but not in the back). But there were any number of ways Boucher could have set that up. The question is why did BLAKE play out the way it did. > That has to do with his loss of his judgement re trust: there is *nothing* > in 'Blake' that indicates it has anything to do with fanaticism. In Blake's own words (and I'm sure you're familiar with his zealous delivery): DEVA: These stupid games you insist on playing, Blake, will get someone killed eventually. BLAKE: I have to test each one myself. Blake goes on to admit that Deva could do the testing via computer, but he still won't let go of the need to test them himself. Blake's inability to sway from a course that he recognizes to be dangerous and unnecessary suggests a "person with excessive attachment to an activity," which is one of my dictionary's definitions of a fanatic. > well (Blake's warm relationship with Deva, bearing in mind how clearly we > were told Travis had no friends; You're losing me here. This has nothing to do with having friends or trusting. It has to do with what fuels behavior. > The idea appears to me to be sort of like sleight of hand - get the viewer > to doubt Blake for a while, to think exactly what Mac4781@aol suggests - > then aha! - show that's he's still a genuine rebel, still one of the Good, > if badly Battered Guys - You're losing me here as well. This has nothing to do with whether Blake was genuinely a bounty hunter or still a rebel. The scene that confirms Blake's irrational behavior doesn't come until near the end when the audience *knows* he's still one of the Good Guys. The question is why would Boucher put that in there. He could have given Blake a rational reason for needing to test possible recruits. Instead he presented his behavior as irrational. > [a] trying to make it seem - even subliminally - that Blake was somehow > 'worthy' of being killed does a rather horrible, almost cheapening hatchet > job on the tragedy Chris has given us. Why do you have 'worthy' in quotes? I never said Blake was somehow 'worthy' of being killed. I pointed out things I saw as parallels between STAR ONE and BLAKE. I pointed out that Chris just might have had it in the back of his mind that he needed to tone down the extent of Avon's culpability. Nowhere did I say Blake deserved to die. Carol

1 0

Re: Avon and Gan (was Dinosaurs)
by Helen Krummenacker 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

Neil wrote: >Anyway, Avon's not a bit like Gan. They were both depressed about their girlfriends (supposedly) being killed by the Federation. Hey, do you think Gan's woman was actually a top secret agent? -- Harriet Wouldn't it have been something if Gan had made it to third season, and Anna was also his woman?

1 0

Re: Dinosaurs (was Re:[B7L] Crichton (was decentring morality)]
by Betty Ragan 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

Harriet wrote: > Hey, do you think Gan's woman was actually a top secret agent? Maybe Anna was also running Gan... -- Betty Ragan ** bragan(a)nrao.edu ** http://www.aoc.nrao.edu/~bragan Not speaking for my employers, officially or otherwise. "Seeing a rotten picture for the special effects is like eating a tough steak for the smothered onions..." -- Isaac Asimov

1 0

Fwd: Re: [B7L] decentring morality
by Sally Manton 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

Dana wrote: <It could also be a class thing--Alphas are commissioned officers as soon as they finish basic training?> Well, the Federation's forces are stretched thin, especially in the 3rd & 4th series. I can see a historical parallel actually - towards the end of WW2, teenage boys from the Hitler Youth (a paramilitary organisation) were given officer status and commanded even younger boys in the fighting - and if I recall correctly, could and did consider shooting other boys for 'desertion'. A case of must needs, and quite applicable if the Federation's cannon-fodder cupboard is bare (indoctrinated children from paramilitary organisations are easier to mould into Death Squad types and Arlens, methinks). _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

1 0

Re: [B7L] Crichton (was decentring morality)
by Sally Manton 29 Sep '01

29 Sep '01

Neil: <If the B7 crew were all dinosaurs, what ones would they be?> and Una: <Avon - Barney.> Nah, he's too much like Gan. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

4 3

Jump to page:

2025

2024

2023

2022

2021

2020

2019

2018

2017

2016

2015

2014

2013

2012

2011

2010

2009

2008

2007

2006

2005

2004

2003

2002

2001

Blakes7