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5511 discussions

Re: [B7L] Nonfic on the Lyst
by Tavia 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

Cheryl wrote: >This is what is happening on a board that I belong to, >we discuss a new episode every week ... it is great, >I think something like this would be great for here :-) Hmm... let's get this straight... One episode a week for Lysator, one episode a month for FC, three pieces of fanfic half-promised to one person or another (all stuck solid), an essay promised but unstarted, three zines unread by my bedside, one LOC sadly overdue, a zine review promised, a zine print-run to do, another zine to edit... and ... ... Wasn't there some work I was supposed to be doing?..... Tavia (and some people manage multiple fandoms? and sex too? perhaps they don't need sleep...)

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Re: [B7L] Re: Interpretation (fading into Canon, again)
by Mac4781＠aol.com 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

Andrew wrote: > Better go, I can hear the TN pounding on the door.... Fortunately for you, Andrew, you have a few credits with the Tarrant Nostra Accounting Department in appreciation of your gorgeous Tarrant art in Chronicles 64. But we will be keeping an eye on you, and on your zine credit pages. The "Del 'some say I'm illiterate, but it's untrue' Tarrant" did not slip by our notice. Carol Mc, Supreme Godmother of the Tarrant Nostra

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Re: [B7L] Terry Nation as Writer
by Tavia 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

Re Fiona's interesting post. One could postulate other reasons for the set-up in 'Aftermath'. The episode is obviously intended to introduce Dayna. Reading 'The Inside Story' it's apparent that Josette Simon was hired primarily for her skin colour, youth, looks, and lack of ethnic or American accent. The account there mentions only David Moloney and Vere Lorimer in this context, but it's hard to see that they would have made casting decisions impacting so obviously on character without overt back-up from Terry Nation, who owned the concept and continued to write three key 3rd season episodes. On a 'give the gal a USP' principle, this blank young slate acquires the weapons tech background. From there on in, one can see the episode 'Aftermath' developing ... sexually naive young gal (the kiss in the cave), weapons tech background (all the Hal Mellanby stuff to which Fiona refers), oh dear we've lost Jenna, so we need a blonde bimbette replacement (Lauren). Hack writing at its worst (best?). I'm not saying this is what happened, but I think it's a plausible alternative scenario. Considering the 9 Chris Boucher episodes *as a whole*, a high proportion of them have the plot complexity, the political machinations &c that Fiona characterises as his style, though there are exceptions (Rescue, City). Considering the 19 Terry Nation episodes *as a whole*, a high proportion of them appear to be basically hack adventure writing with any complexities sufficiently well hidden as to escape this viewer entirely. Tavia

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Re: [B7L] re: Perception
by Tavia 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

Alison wrote: >For example the 'frame' in rock music in 1976 may have >included such axioms as - artistic virtuosity is a good in itself, >production values enhance the emotional impact of music, >there is a big gap between the role of fan and the role of >musician, etc. and then a very simple song like (say) 'white riot' >can challenge those axioms. Thanks for the very clear explanation, Alison. (Recalling several years of being involved with an amateur band that produced cover versions of various early Dire Straits songs which, to my mind, were better than the originals, perhaps that's not the only way of challenging the gap between fan and musician...) >Similarly a quite simple piece of B7 fanfic can challenge >(could challenge) axioms to do with the separation of producer >and consumer, or the location of the 'frame' that separates >reading a text from responding to it, and soon. While all this is true, indeed self-evident, surely it applies to *all* fanfic, independent of any other criteria. Tavia

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re: Perception
by Alison Page 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

Tavia said - >>In my experience of fanfic -- limited I know -- I'd say that there was a strong positive correlation between complexity of the text and seriousness of the questions addressed.<< I know what you mean, but perhaps sometimes a very simple text - or indeed song - can raise very complex questions. If, for example, it 'steps outside the frame' (to coin the phrase everyone seems to be using at present). For example the 'frame' in rock music in 1976 may have included such axioms as - artistic virtuosity is a good in itself, production values enhance the emotional impact of music, there is a big gap between the role of fan and the role of musician, etc. and then a very simple song like (say) 'white riot' can challenge those axioms. Similarly a quite simple piece of B7 fanfic can challenge (could challenge) axioms to do with the separation of producer and consumer, or the location of the 'frame' that separates reading a text from responding to it, and so on. That's how I interpret Neils's and others' comments on the punk and fanfiction comparison, anyway Alison ********************************************************************** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.mimesweeper.com **********************************************************************

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Re: Interpretation (fading into Canon, again)
by Andrew Williams 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

Neil wrote: >Why pick on DotG? <snip> >And a load of tripe about bald dwarfs. That's not tripe, that's a Clue [TM]! Tarrant is actually a bald dwarf with no teeth, but no one notices because he wears a sopron medallion under his space-skivvies. Better go, I can hear the TN pounding on the door....

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Re: [B7L] Re: Ethics and Hal Mellanby
by Fiona Moore 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

>From: Stephen Date <stephend999(a)yahoo.co.uk> > > Coming back in on this thread... Dayna says about > > the Sarrans: "Father says > > they were a problem when we first arrived, now they > > leave us alone." > > > > In the same scene, actually, Dayna says that Lauren > > has "lived with us > > since she was a child"-- so she might not have been > > a baby, in which case > > the female infanticide hypothesis is void. > > > > Anyway, if she was a baby who was exposed, how is it > > that Chel knows who she > > is? I think if female infanticide is a common > > practice he's unlikely to make > > the connection between a baby being abandoned and a > > baby turning up with the > > Mellanbys if they did find her soon after they > > landed-- she could just have > > likely have come with them on the ship in that case, > > and he'd've expected > > the abandoned baby to have died. It's not that > > likely he'd be keeping > > head-count stats on the ship's population :), and > > Lauren's skin colour is no > > proof that she's not an alien-- Avon, Servalan and > > the two soldiers are all > > white, after all. If she came to live with the > > Mellanbys a bit later, then > > Chel would know the whole story. > >I've always assumed that the Sarrans were going to do >something nasty to Lauren and Mellanby intervened on >Dayna's urging It's a good point, but the one problem I'd have is that both Mellanbys treat the Sarrans more or less like animals-- as I said before, they seem to have no contact with them other than zapping them and/or shooting them full of arrows, and Dayna's remark that the Sarrans gave them trouble when they first arrived but now leave them alone also doesn't suggest close acquaintance. Basically, it seems to me like the Mellanbys wouldn't have gotten close enough to the Sarrans to find out what sort of (political or religious) practices they have vis-a-vis doing nasty things to children. >Incidentally I'm surprised that Servalan didn't go >back to Sarran and grab a shed load of the self-aiming >guns. Might have done wonders for the Federation >Troopers marksmanship ! Who says she didn't :)? >If you want to detect colonialism in B7 Aftermath is a >much stronger contender than Deliverance :-) It's more blatant in Aftermath, but I think they're both pretty good candidates. Fiona The Posthumous Memoirs of Secretary Rontane Educating the natives at http://nyder.r67.net _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com

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Re: [B7L] Re: Ethics and Hal Mellanby
by Jenny Kaye 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

Harriet wrote: >It's possible that Mellanby had some contact with the Sarrans when he >arrived, and that relations broke down later. This could be any reason >from "Mellanby is horrified to find that they kill unwanted baby girls, >so rescues one and then withdraws into his ship" to "Mellanby kidnaps a >baby girl to provide a companion for his daughter, and is forced to >withdraw before the Sarrans can take revenge". Or something completely >unrelated to baby girls. But IIRC the Sarrans had a prophecy about how people coming from the sky would destroy them-- even if Mellanby wanted contact, I doubt they were really wanting to meet the new neighbours :-). Jenny _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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Re: [B7L] surveillance cameras
by Tavia 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

Steve K wrote: >Well, for one thing, computers. Much of the push has been because >the police have database, the inland revenue has them, insurance >companies, social security, child car, etc, etc. And they're all wrong, >to some degree. It seems sensible to tie the information in, so that >you don't have to tell your tax office when you move, the hospitals >know about your national insurance contributions, etc, etc. It's just -- to me -- these kinds of issue are some of the major ways in which 2001 UK differs from Federation society in TWB. The thought of a single central database which ties up my insurance record, my medical record, my tax/employment record &c&c scares me witless. Tavia

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Re: [B7L] surveillance cameras
by Deborah Day 03 Apr '01

03 Apr '01

This email was delivered to you by The Free Internet, a Business Online Group company. http://www.thefreeinternet.net --------------------------------------------------------------- Personally, I'd like the cameras to be mandatory at stoplights -- there are WAY too many pinheads around who seem to think that red lights don't apply to *them*. Hear Hear (me too) Debbie

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