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5511 discussions

Re: [B7L] Frame capture vote results
by Marian de Haan 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

Sally and Una: >> ... which underOg are we going to vote in next time <g>? Sorry, but not even for the scenes showing off the eyelashes am I going to vote for Power ...<< >It does have high irony value, however. > >What about 'Time Squad'?< Endorsed. (I'd nominate Volcano, but in view of my longing for more S1 episodes...) Marian

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Carry on b7
by Deborah Day 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

This email was delivered to you by The Free Internet, a Business Online Group company. http://www.thefreeinternet.net --------------------------------------------------------------- Now this has really touched a nerve - the two things had so much in common - extremely popular, derided by the powers that be, cheap sets etc, quality writing. Maybe Neil could do a proper script?? I still have fond memories of both Molesworth and the Avon's Gardening diary - I am sure he could do it justice. I think Kenneth Williams should be Orac though, I can just hear Orac saying Infamy, infamy, they've all got it in for me! Debbie

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Auron Psychoanalysis
by Dana Shilling 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

How does being cloned affect Cally (and other Auronar, of course)? In Harvest of Kairos Cally sees "her mother and father" in the Sopron, although presumably she wouldn't have one. Are clones raised in "cheaper by the dozen" nuclear families or in collective care centers? And do Auronar think of Terran h-saps as the same species, a related species, a different species? -(Y)

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Re: [B7L] Frame capture vote results
by Sally Manton 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

Lisa wrote: <-- but what is the attraction of "Voice From the Past"? I know I've seen that one, but I honestly can just barely remember it.> and Joanne: <<racks brain> Must be the yoga bit at the beginning, with Avon in something more approachable-looking than usual. Same people who'd vote for Aftermath (the shirt, you know) might've voted for it. Perhaps. The alternative being Travis's mummy act...> Rats. I thought my mummies-in-bathrobe fixation has escaped detection ... _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Re: [B7L] Frame capture vote results
by Sally Manton 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

Una wrote: <What about 'Time Squad'?> Ooooh, yes please. Your taste, m'dear, is as impeccable as - well - *mine* :-) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Re: [B7L] Frame capture vote results
by Sally Manton 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

Una wrote: <Yeesss!! High five, Sally?> Too right! Only ... ... which underOg are we going to vote in next time <g>? Sorry, but not even for the scenes showing off the eyelashes am I going to vote for Power ... _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Frame capture vote results
by Sally Manton 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

Lisa wrote: <And the winners are: Weapon Horizon Voice From the Past Animals> Oh yes oh yes oh joy ... thank you everyone, you have made one 2nd-season-obsessive Lyst member very very happy. (Una, we *both* did it!!) _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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Carry on Rebelling
by Dana Shilling 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

Well, clearly in a B7 Carry On film the handguns would be a LOT bigger (fnaar, fnaar). BLAKE (Sid James) [speaking into teleport bracelet after landing on damp planet] Watch out for the sodden ground... SERVALAN (Hattie Jacques) [appears from behind tree holding VERY LARGE gun]: There's no call for that sort of language. I'm pretty sure Barbara Windsor would be Jenna (and, for that matter, Miss Brahms in Are You Being Liberated? in which case Mrs. Cally Slocombe would keep wittering about accommodations for her moondisk...) The following is an actual quote from Harlan Kennedy's article, "Carry On Up Your Comment" in the January/February 1993 issue of Film Comment: "The films perpetrated the following insults to pure cinema: *The camera was used baldly and boldly as a recording instrument for stand-and-deliver performances *The sets were knocked up as quickly and cheaply as for a school play, and looked it. Either that or they were cannibalized from other film sets at the same studio *The characters were walking stereotypes used and reused from film to film." -(Y)

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Re: [B7L] Auron Psychoanalysis
by Ellynne G. 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

On Mon, 23 Jul 2001 10:59:38 -0400 "Dana Shilling" <dshilling(a)worldnet.att.net> writes: > How does being cloned affect Cally (and > other Auronar, of course)? In Harvest of > Kairos Cally sees "her mother and father" > in the Sopron, although presumably she > wouldn't have one. Actually, we don't _know_ that Cally didn't have biological parents who she grew up with. Let's look at what we do know about Auron cloning. 1. Cally's sister was about the same age as her. If not really the same age, then probably not a difference of more than a couple years either way if not (assuming human standards of aging). 2. It has to be stated to one of the Auron leaders that Cally's sister is genetically identical, so nonclone siblings are common enough cloning is not assumed but certainly not so uncommon that Cally and Zelda's relation creates surprises. Right at this point, it seems more likely that Cally and Zelda were not necessarily clones in the sense of Dolly but that they were artificially created twins (compared to actual cloning, it's much simpler to do this with a fertilized egg cell) being raised by their biological parents. We can assume _biological_ parents because the image the stone threw at Cally was based not on her memories but on stone's image of her. 3. While Servalan expresses surprise that Frantor is the normal, biological child of her father, I think Servalan's idea of family values is distorted enough that we could discount most of it in relation to her own culture (example: I wouldn't be surprised if it turned out Servalan had killed her own parents to get where she is - but I would be surprised if patricide was a narm within the Federation). In relation to a foreign, isolationist culture she's had no contact with except for one rebel, it can be dismissed without supporting evidence. My guess would still be that cloning is pushed for two main reasons, that children raised with a cloned sibling have an easier time developing their telepathy (supporting evidence implied by what's said about Cally and Zelda) and that there may be times they want to create a younger twin of a person already living. Are clones raised in > "cheaper by the dozen" nuclear families or > in collective care centers? First, let's look at Auron in general. It's an isolationist planet and apparently has no colony worlds. Its population is largely limited to one world even though they don't seem to be newcomers on the galactic field, so we can assume some population stability. Cally and Zelda followed different career paths, so they don't seem to be those mass produced kind of clones who are all raised up for one job or type of job. Then, let's look at what we know about people. Raising a child is a labor intensive job. There's a reason for the shift from orphanages to foster care tied to this fact. Collective care centers beat some of the options, but they shouldn't be a society's first choice on how to raise large numbers of its population given alternatives. Also, sudden increases in population, historically, have usually put pressure on societies as they face the difficulty of acculturating the baby boom (a 19th century example was called "the bilateral invasion of the barbarians"). While the horrors may be overrated, it's a valid issue and doesn't fit what little we know of Auron. So, we have a planet with no pressing reason to mass produce large numbers of people and serious questions about how they would raise them if they did. For me, this seems to again imply children being raised by their own families. Not as exciting as mass produced clones, but there you go. It wouldn't surprise me designer genes weren't an issue on their planet or if parents didn't check over the DNA of any potential children, but I think the main selling point of artificial wombs would be clear to anyone familiar with the natural sort (see also: C-sections, feet first delivery, pregnancy - complications of, childbirth mortality). And do Auronar > think of Terran h-saps as the same species, > a related species, a different species? Good question. There's evidence of genetic similarity, but how much anyone's willing to admit to it seems to vary from episode to episode. I'd guess it was a touchy issue. Terran humans seem to be xenophobic and not to understand a lot of basic biology. Aurons probably understand the biology but probably aren't willing to admit the relationship. Ellynne ________________________________________________________________ GET INTERNET ACCESS FROM JUNO! Juno offers FREE or PREMIUM Internet access for less! Join Juno today! For your FREE software, visit: http://dl.www.juno.com/get/tagj.

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Re: [B7L] Frame capture vote results
by J MacQueen 24 Jul '01

24 Jul '01

>From: Lisa Williams <lisa(a)eroicafans.org> >-- but what is >the attraction of "Voice From the Past"? I know I've seen that one, but I >honestly can just barely remember it. <racks brain> Must be the yoga bit at the beginning, with Avon in something more approachable-looking than usual. Same people who'd vote for Aftermath (the shirt, you know) might've voted for it. Perhaps. The alternative being Travis's mummy act... Regards Joanne _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp

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