Blakes7

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5511 discussions

Orbit
by Leia Fee 23 May '01

23 May '01

Steve wrote... >An interesting possibility would be if one of the pair didn't weigh enough. Not >very good on weights, but I would suspect that Dayna would be below weight. 70-odd kilos is about 9stone I believe. Yeah I think Dayne was probably under that. >If it was Dayna and Avon, would Avon sacrifice himself knowing that throwing Dayna off >(assuming he could) wouldn't be enough? I think possibly. Avon I think has the kind of nature to think that calmly and logically even when faced with his own death. I have trouble seeing him as the self sacrifing kind though, even for the most logical of reasons. I can see him chucking her off and spending however long he had left trying to find something to make up the weight. Leia

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H&H: Avon
by Susan Beth 23 May '01

23 May '01

NOTE: all quotes are from "The Complete Writer's Guide to Heroes and Heroines." I'm leaving a lot out - most of which applies, some of which doesn't. If you want the latter, well, buy the book. It's interesting. ;-) -- -- -- -- -- -- -- Avon is clearly a layered Bad Boy/Professor. (Remember, layered characters have conflicting emotions and goals, and are frequently at war with themselves over what to do.) Let's start with the Bad Boy aspects: "The BAD BOY struts into every room, daring one and all to knock the chip from his shoulder. It may seem that he cares nothing for the opinion of others, but in fact, the reverse is true. .... As far as he is concerned, it is not his fault other people cannot - or will not - see the man beneath the image." "His allure is irresistible. Women are attracted to this cool, wild and moody man like moths to a forbidden flame." "The BAD BOY covers up his smoldering passions with a leather jacket and a cocky smirk." "Behind his insolent stare lies a disappointed idealist-a man who wants to believe in honor and integrity, he cannot quite do so. He keeps his secrets deep inside himself, trusting no one. Beware. If pushed, he can show a dark and angry side." "Life either dealt him a lousy hand or changed the rules when he was holding four of a kind. Unwilling to play the game society expects of him, he follows his own code of conduct. There are lines he will not cross, but only he decides where those lines are drawn. If he does give his word-a rare occurrence!-he keeps it." Under virtues: "Street Smart - This is the guy to have around when walking down a dark alley or when confronting a con artist." Under flaws: "Pessimistic-He has learned the hard way that most people tend to be selfish. The BAD BOY expects the worst from everyone; it is safer than letting his guard down and being hurt. He is leery about trusting anyone with his heart." "Bitter-The BAD BOY never forgets. His idealism has been crushed and only resentment and animosity remain. He carries his grudge with pride." "BAD BOYS: + like to be their own bosses + do not enjoy being told what to do + won't do a job that goes against their principles + are not the easiest guys to get along with" Amusingly, under suggested occupations, #2 is Computer Hacker and #3 is Outlaw. ;-) Turning to The Professor layer: "The PROFESSOR has all the answers. He takes the time to examine every aspect of an issue. This guy is logical, introverted and faithful. No fast breaks or hurried decisions for him. When he makes a commitment, he invariably follows through, but he will do it in his own time, and only after all the facts are in." "The PROFESSOR's strength is his intellect or special ability. Expert in one field or many, he has turned his life into one big science project. Every experience, every emotions, every physical sensation has been the subject of object observation. He is thoughtful, but not necessarily considerate." "He is used to being the smarted man in the room. His genius has set him apart from others for most of his life. However, this experience does not make it any easier for him to remember to communicate on levels understood by the less gifted. The inability of other people to keep up with him intellectually is a constant source of frustration for him. As a result, his social skills may not be up to par." "Trust the PROFESSOR to find the solution, but do not expect any explanations. They would be too hard to understand anyway." Under virtues: "Expert-Not just smart, the PROFESSOR also is educated. ...Whatever his chosen field, he is the recognized authority." "Analytical-This is a man who thinks before he acts." "Genuine-The PROFESSOR has not developed the disguises others have. When he gives his heart, he is painfully vulnerable. True to his commitments, he never pretends something he does not actually feel." Under flaws: "Insular-He inhabits his own world and is unwilling to make room for others. The PROFESSOR knows everything about his field of choice, but nothing at all about other aspects of life. Devoting one's life to building that better mousetrap does not leave much time for socializing." He falls into the MR. ORGANIZED style: "His desk is immaculate, his home is immaculate and he is always immaculate." For suggested occupations, #2 is Computer Programmer. ;-) Susan Beth (susanbeth33(a)mindspring.com)

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Re: [B7L] Smacks round the head
by Sally Manton 23 May '01

23 May '01

Leia wrote: <Speaking of... has anyone noticed how almost every SF series always has one character who seems to get more than their fair share of horrible tramuas? B7 seems to share them out more fairly. Almost everyone gets to have a good few crises' and smacks about the head.> True, but as the Hero (eponymous or otherwise) I fo think Blake and Avon got more than their share of being thumped (that's how just about *everyone* got a turn as rescuing Fearless Leader :-)). And once he led the credits, Avon got hit on the *head* more often than everyone else (three times in Power, I think that's the record!). Probably one reason *why* he wanted to find Blake again, so he could go back to giving out the headaches instead of having them. _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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Re: [B7L] Re: Space Fall
by Tavia 23 May '01

23 May '01

Steve wrote: >What is also interesting is that religion is being used on Cygnus Alpha >whereas it seems non-existent in the rest of the Federation. Leaving open the question of just what *did* motivate people in the apparent absence of organised religion, Stalinist-style president worship, or plain old-fashioned keeping up with the Jones's. Tavia

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Re: [B7L] Re: Orbit
by Marian de Haan 23 May '01

23 May '01

Steve Rogerson asked: >If it was Dayna and Avon, would Avon sacrifice himself knowing that throwing Dayna off (assuming he could) wouldn't be enough?< No, he'd sacrifice his studded leathers. Together with Dayna they'd probably made the weight. Marian

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Re: [B7L] Quoting B7 at friends
by Leia Fee 23 May '01

23 May '01

Message text written by INTERNET:Carolyn772@aol.com >><< You obviously weren't as convincing as Avon >> >That or the lack of a sidearm... :)< Good point.<grin> Leia

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Re: [B7L] H&H: intro comments
by Tavia 22 May '01

22 May '01

Susan Beth wrote: >...I realized that you can pair the male/female types up, one to one, >with the differences between the two being due to social and gender >factors. Rather annoying... Though I suppose one should perhaps make allowances for fictional representations rather than an attempt at realism? >...we all (that is, people in general) have grown up being >exposed to these hero archetypes our entire lives, from nursery school >tales and fairy tales and on through every book read and hour of television >or movies watched. As a result we are quick to spot the telling traits, >and assign a new character to the 'proper' role - which is a great help to >writers. It might be more general than that. The urge to understand and predict the behaviour of things seems fundamental to intelligence; assigning complex objects such as people into neat pigeonholes where various characteristics are bundled is just an unfortunate side effect. >it could be that it also introduces a bias in what we consider 'important' >or 'pertinent' evidence when we watch B7. Once we have (consciously or >not) decided that Gan is The Best Friend, we note and remember the details >that point that way, and dismiss as unimportant or 'accidents' of >production/continuity errors details that don't fit. Too true. I was trying and perhaps failing to express this idea when I posted on preconceptions and gentle giants...... I shall be interested to see what the book comes up with for the other characters. Tavia

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Re: Orbit
by Steve Rogerson 22 May '01

22 May '01

Marian said: "he'd sacrifice his studded leathers. Together with Dayna they'd probably made the weight." No, there are limits beyond which even Avon won't go -- cheers Steve Rogerson http://homepages.poptel.org.uk/steve.rogerson Redemption 03, 21-23 February 2003, Ashford, Kent Celebrating 25 years of Blake's 7 and 10 years of Babylon 5 http://www.smof.com/redemption

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AutoPost: Lyst Culture Guide
by kat＠welkin.apana.org.au 22 May '01

22 May '01

Guide to Lyst Culture ********************** (written for the B7 mailing list at <http://lists.lysator.liu.se/mailman/listinfo/blakes7>) composed by Kathryn Andersen version 1.02 Considering the number of newbies who have admitted to being nearly frightened away by the manner of folks on this list, and wondering how much larger the number who *were* frightened away, I figured it was a good idea to write a Gentle Introduction which will lift confusion and humanise the apparently terrifying denizens of these electronic halls. Me saw need, me wrote. If me make mistakes, please tell, so corrections entered. This is by no means meant to replace the actual Lyst FAQ (at <http://www.lysator.liu.se/~calle/b7list/FAQ.html>) but serve as an adjunct to it. This is *not* a rule-set of customs. It is *descriptive* not proscriptive. The actuality, not the ideal. The distillation of our understanding of what the Lyst is like, so that folks don't have to read a year's worth of posts in order to get an idea of what the heck is going on here... Also, if you're new to the net, you might find the following helpful - common E-Mail abbreviations <http://www.zeusprod.com/glossary/mailterm.html> - Netiquette (net etiquette) <http://dir.yahoo.com/Computers_and_Internet/Internet/Beginner_s_Guides/Neti…> - The Google Search Engine <http://www.google.com> which I used to find the above URLs... Lyst Culture In A Bottle ************************* What's this "Lyst" business? ============================= The mailing list <blakes7(a)lists.lysator.liu.se> was, so far as I know, the first Blake's 7 (electronic) mailing list to be created (and it also predates the newsgroup). Note the "lysator" in the address. Since there are other lists (most notably, the Other List (see Lyst FAQ)), presumably to save having to say "the lysator List", a shorthand for that is simply "the Lyst". Our Esteemed Listowner, Calle, is not a woman. This doesn't stop people calling him "Cally", indeed, it would be almost irresistible not to, considering the subject of this List. Nobody outside his native country can actually pronounce his name correctly, but it may help those who want to try, to keep in mind that "Calle" comes from the same root as "Carl". Not only that, it's a common short form of Carl, in the same way that Dick is for Richard. Contrary to rumour, "lysator" does not mean "liberator" in Calle's native tongue. It apparently doesn't mean anything in particular. Posting Style ============== Unlike many other lists, we don't tend to be chatty, and off-topic posts are (after a while) encouraged to go to the Spin-off list (see Lyst FAQ), so that we can get down to the serious business of discussing the political systems in B7 or the nature of terrorism or how teleportation works; or the lighthearted business of Avon's red leather trousers or what kind of ice cream the particular characters would prefer, or how to recast the series. It isn't a required custom on this list to introduce yourself, though a few people like to. People also don't tend to issue a formal welcome to newbies -- we just get on with the discussion and expect folks to join in (or not). Please don't consider this unfriendly; it's simply... focused. We're always interested in fresh ideas. If someone doesn't respond to your posting it could simply be because they agreed with it -- and didn't want to write a "me too" post. On the other hand, feel free to consider this unfriendly... but if you do, then it behooves you to go and welcome people, don't it? If the Lyst seems particularly busy and snarky, it's probably February. Odd Acronyms and Other Collections ================================== If you are confused by people referring to "the wrath of FINALACT" or suchlike, be confused no longer. As with many online fandoms, groups of like-minded fans often declare allegiance to their particular favourite characters, and form groups. Generally in order to be part of such a group... one simply declares oneself to be part of it. One doesn't have to be part of any group at all, and these groups are not meant to be taken deadly seriously either. Though some are more tongue-in-cheek than others. Often they are formed of those who consider their view to be a minority one. The Tarrant Nostra ------------------ Yes, this one doesn't have odd acronyms but with such a cool name, who needs them? The first known reference to the Tarrant Nostra by that name is apparently in 1995, though the core group was around for longer than that. The name sprung from the mind of Brooke Barker. This group, is, obviously, those who favour Tarrant. Carol McCoy is "The Godmother" of the Tarrant Nostra; other members may not be so clearly identified. See Also <http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/TarrantNostra/tarrant.htm> F.I.N.A.L.A.C.T. ---------------- This stands for "Foundation Invalidating Numerous Accusations Levelled At Croucher's Travis". These are the fans who prefer Brian Croucher's Travis, aka Travis II. They have a tendency to threaten detractors with The Comfy Chair, Karaoke music and Teletubby torture. Jacqueline Thijsen is the Chief Inquisitor. Penny Dreadful is their Queen, hopeful of being elevated to godhood, so that Iain Coleman can be Pope. See also <http://tezcatlipoca.algonet.se/cgi-bin/getbyid.pl?id=26736> G.I.T.H.O.G. ------------ This stands for "Greif Is Travis, House Of Greif". Byline -- 'In Time, We All Come to Greif'. These are the fans who prefer Stephen Grief's Travis, aka Travis I. They appear to be less active than FINALACT, probably because they don't perceive themselves to be in the minority. See also <http://tezcatlipoca.algonet.se/cgi-bin/getbyid.pl?id=33344> A.S.K.S. -------- Avon's Sympathetic Kindred Spirits go against the flow of Avon fans because they don't give a fig whether he looks sexy in black leather, they just identify with him. Kathryn Andersen made up this acronym, so she is presumably the founding member. Gareth's Gorillas ----------------- Fans who are into Gareth Thomas and his work, as distinct from just being interested in Blake (though they are interested in Blake too). Chief Gorilla is Judith Proctor. One may see them at cons wearing "Gareth's Gorilla" badges. The Gan Defence League ---------------------- Those who appreciate the unsung and oft under-appreciated Olag Gan. Judith Proctor goes around distributing oak leaves to those who stand up for Gan and say nice things about him. S.C.A.M. -------- Society for Crushing Animals Maligners, given a name by Una McCormack, the (almost) sole person who not only liked the episode "Animals", but strives to defend it. Dedicated to the art of Justinification (justifying Justin). Followers of the Goddess ------------------------ The concept of the Golden Goddess Soolin, her Acolyte Dayna, and the Chief Hairdresser Vila was the invention of Ophelia (aka Kanna-Ophelia, aka (name suppressed on request))... not quite as gone as we thought. J.A.D.E. -------- Jarriere's Always Discriminating Enthusiasts don't actually tend to use this acronym a lot, but their influence has been far-reaching; not only did they get this minor character who only appeared in one episode (Gambit... Travis called him a powder-puff) into the top 20 of an online poll of favourite SF characters.... but they actually persuaded a fannish model-maker to include Jarriere into their line of die-cast models (after Avon, Blake, Travis and Vila). They are led by Harriet Monkhouse, who, after another Harriet joined the Lyst in 2001, decided to style herself Jarriet (or Harriere) to cut down on possibilities of mistaken identity. Avon Without Guilt ------------------ Not a terribly active group these days, but Pat Nussman founded "AWG" -- Avon Without Guilt. As in, yes, we *know* it's terribly common; we *know* that more discerning tastes move on from their first attraction to the Dark and Snarly One in favor of the more arcane delights of, oh, The Thane and Bruce; we *know* he has a less than stellar character. So what? We still love him, and we refuse to be guilty about it. It is worthwhile noting that Barbara Paul dedicated one of her novels to the Avon Without Guilt group. See <http://www.barbarapaul.com/holland.html> Sickly Equines =============== Certain topics have a habit of coming up over and over again. I'm reluctant to call them dead horses, because it can be the case that a newbie can actually offer new insight that nobody's thought of before, and pass the hand of healing over what was once assumed to be a corpse. - Hey, Maybe Avon Shot Blake's Clone! - Was Blake a Freedom Fighter Or A Terrorist? Should Blake Have Destroyed Star One? - Avon Was Mad (No He Wasn't) - Was Travis only following orders? Hot Topics ========== One topic which is pretty much guaranteed to start the fires burning no matter how nicely and calmly people may start the discussion, is slash. If you don't know what slash is, don't worry, since you probably don't want to argue about it either. An oldish summary of the pro-slash position from Susan Beth can be found at <ftp://ftp.lysator.liu.se/pub/blake7/misc/slash.defense> A summary of the anti-slash position is at <http://www.katspace.com/b7/slashsum.html> Another topic which tends to set the sparks flying is Horizon, the biggest and oldest B7 fan club. Or, more specifically, its Coodinator/Treasurer/etc, Diane Gies. I'm not going to reiterate it here, that would just stir people up again. Any topic can raise the temperature if it is pursued obnoxiously enough. There has been steam coming out of ears over - whether Deliverance is Sexist - posting style - con reports - religion just to name a few. But don't let that scare you off, we're generally quite calm and rational... Signs that a thread has gone on too long at too high a temperature are - posters start repeating themselves (worst case, reposting earlier posts of their own) - postings degenerate into a "he said, she said" dissection of why what so-and-so said was insulting. INTJ? MBTI? Huh? ================== Once upon a time, someone first brought up the idea of figuring out the Myers-Briggs (personality) Type Indicator for each of the characters. It was mentioned briefly once before, but the topic truly exploded in February 1998 when Adam Fuller posted this -- <http://tezcatlipoca.algonet.se/cgi-bin/getbyid.pl?id=21161> Much discussion ensued, and many people went off to <http://www.keirsey.com> to take the personality tests there to figure out their own type. Of those who took the tests and actually reported back, the majority appeared to be either INTJ or INTP types (and, oddly enough, the consensus was that Avon was either an INTJ or an INTP). This probably explains why the posting style of the list appears so unfriendly -- half of us are closet Avons. Some people are sick of this topic. Others remain fascinated by it. Penguins? What's that got to do with B7? ========================================= The connection between penguins and B7 can only be explained by the one who discovered the sinister conspiracy in the first place. For some reason, Calle seems to think it was Una McCormack, but the rest of the world blames it on Neil Faulkner. <http://homepages.tesco.net/~N.Faulkner/blakes7/darkheart/darkheart.htm> Except for Neil, who blames it on Alison Page. Acknowledgements ================ Thanks (in no particular order) to Penny Dreadful, Calle Dybedahl, Neil Faulkner, Una McCormack, Tavia, Mistral, Steve Rogerson, Ophelia, Andrew Williams, Sandra Kisner, M, Harriet Monkhouse, Jacqueline Thijsen, Wildean, Harriet, Carol McCoy, Susan Beth, Tiger M, Sandra Kisner, Carolyn for additions, comments and corrections. Where To Find It ================ This FAQ-ish thing can be found on the web at <http://www.katspace.com/b7/lyst.html> and posted on the Lyst once a month. Wed May 23 01:06:00 EST 2001

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Re: [B7L] OT Response to Rita Part 2
by Rita d' Orac 22 May '01

22 May '01

...I've replied to this one offlist too. ===== rita d'orac "If you think of this mouse as a space captain..." http://www.vilaworld.com ____________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.co.uk address at http://mail.yahoo.co.uk or your free @yahoo.ie address at http://mail.yahoo.ie

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