Blakes7 February 2001

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80 participants
929 discussions

Re: [B7L] liking 'character'
by Natasa Tucev 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

Harriet Bazley wrote: >here's my attempt at a more plausible re-rendering, from Vila's point of >view. <snip> Bravo! Thank you, Harriet! This is exactly what I had in mind. The same premise, the same emotion, but much more subtlety, much better writing style. Needless to say, >"Avon has a remarkable talent for self-preservation." Blake's face was >as stubbornly shuttered now as Avon's own. > >"Yes -- when he wants." is now really poignant, unlike, >"Right now he's planning to go out and get caught--because he >knows they'll kill him and because that's easier than living with what you >did to him just now." which IMO was completely banal. >> Admittedly, it's very hard to please me when it comes to fanfic. My ideal >> fanfic would be a mixture of adventure and angst focusing on Blake. > >Oh yes! So I'm not alone after all... N.

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Re: [B7L] liking 'character'
by B7Morrigan＠aol.com 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

> In a message dated 2/14/01 3:26:09 AM Eastern Standard Time, > pennydreadful(a)powersurfr.com writes: > > << .I speculate that perhaps > Annie means it would be very difficult to accurately transcribe "body > language", in comparison to speech, as a means of communication...how would > you go about writing out the Buster Keaton movie playing in your head (well > I know *I've* always got one rolling) to make it ROTFL amusing? Better off > converting into a more dialogue-oriented format. "'X,' said Y [Z-ly]" gets > the point across succinctly, if not always terrifically aesthetically; > where a list of Y's bodily contortions (which in real life or a Buster > Keaton movie *could* communicate "X, Z-ly" very efficiently) will have the > reader skimming ahead for the next period/paragraph break/dirty word. >> Yes, but in B7, particularly with certain characters, their behavior is certainly more communicative than any bit of dialogue. While I agree that there should be a happy medium, I personally like fiction (fanfic or other) that shows the behavior and lets the reader interpret. I find dialogue that explains everything, particularly motivation, to be implausible and it wrecks the story for me. Morrigan "When I get a little money I buy zines; and if any is left I buy food and clothes." (apologies to Erasmus)

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Re: [B7L] Re: Deliverance
by J MacQueen 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

>From: Helen Krummenacker <avona(a)jps.net> >I daresay Avon wouldn't blush if he was teleported out of his cabin onto >the flight deeck while wearing nothing but Speedos, My God, Helen, I don't know whether to be amused or horrified! Regards Joanne I tell you, there would be none of it, no hope for you at all were it not for the seven. --Terry Dowling, "Colouring the Captains" _________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

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Re: [B7L] Re: fanfic; my zine, plus replies to comments on style
by Ashton7＠aol.com 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

In a message dated 2/14/01 3:44:00 PM Eastern Standard Time, N.Faulkner(a)tesco.net writes: << I'm afraid I'm not really sure what that statement's supposed to mean. You can certainly 'show not tell' without having the character say a single word. All you need is a description of what happens, sufficient to let the readers draw their own conclusions. Whether it's interesting to read or not depends largely on the skill of the writer. Whether the tense form used is active or passive is pretty irrelevant. I'd say that the narrative voice (1st person or 3rd person) is more important in deciding what can be shown (or told, for that matter) and how. >> The statement meant exactly what I said it did: bringing the element of "show don't tell" into this discussion isn't relevant. It's a whole different discussion, if you will. Someone (I forget who now), was trying to use "show don't tell" as an argument in favor of "non-verbal." Frankly, I don't see how that works out. Annie

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Re: [B7L] liking 'character'
by B7Morrigan＠aol.com 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

In a message dated 2/14/01 8:23:13 AM Eastern Standard Time, susanbeth33(a)mindspring.com writes about Patricia Cornwell's novels > She's also an ex-lawyer, and was top of the line at that, um, okay. She > used to work with the FBI and CIA as an expert on terrorist psychology. > hmm. She's an expert scuba diver and used to give lessons in it. She's a > pilot. She has super-refined taste on home decorating and cars and clothes > and possessions of all sorts. Despite the overwhelming hours she puts in > (leaving her with no time to devote to them) she is involved in a long term > relationship with a top FBI guy who is insane about her AND she has a > long-term would-be lover/friend in a local police chief. That's a pretty convincing MS. Probably why I prefer P.D. James' Adam Dalgleish. He comes with lots of annoying and human traits and doesn't have a social life. I can identify with that. Morrigan "When I get a little money I buy zines; and if any is left I buy food and clothes." (apologies to Erasmus)

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Re: liking character
by Steve Rogerson 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

Alison wrote: "My thought is that I hope you are coming to Redemption so you can come along to my panel on telepathy in fiction. Steve - when is it? I never got a program" The Redemption programme is now on the web site (you need Acrobat Reader 4.0), but the panel in question (Is telepathy possible or desirable) is 3pm Saturday. -- cheers Steve Rogerson http://homepages.poptel.org.uk/steve.rogerson Redemption: The Blake's 7 and Babylon 5 convention 23-25 February 2001, Ashford, Kent http://www.smof.com/redemption

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Re: verbal vs. non-verbal
by Helen Krummenacker 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

> PS--talking to people who give no non-verbal cues? It's called > the Internet, actually, which is one factor in the frequency of > flame wars. Whereas, for some of us, it allows us to open up more. I can't imagine discussing in person my emotional reactions to things as I sometimes do here. At least, not to anyone I hadn't known for years! In person, my face tends to reflect my physcial reality (pain, stiffness, tension-- all part of fibromyalgia) rather than my emotional reality. People often read me as being mad at them when I just want the fatigue to go away so I can concentrate on what they are saying. OTOH, I do spend a lot of time annoyed at other people. Just not when they think I am. ObB7: Avon's diary would consist of 4 legible words: Vila, shut it NOW! The rest would be in a complex code that would be the nearest thing to unbreakable. In that diary would be his comments on the fashion sense of the others, including "I wore that red-lobster thing today, and you know, none of them even smiled. No sense of irony in haute couture, why do I waste my time trying to amuse them." However, if he sent letters, emails, etc. to Anna, I can picture him getting much more romantic in writing than in person. Also, if he ever decided to approach Cally, he might try leaving a note at her console and see if she would look at *him* after reading it. Blake, OTOH, would prefer to interact in person whenever possible.

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Re: [B7L] liking 'character'
by Tavia Chalcraft 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

Neil wrote: >All that I've read suggests that men and women both >respond to dangerous lifestyles in a pretty similar way. >And a way, incidentally, that is generally not reflected in >fanfic - crude humour, cruder practical jokes, behaviour >that in more comfortable surroundings would be taken as >outright nastiness, sarcastic putdowns, emotional silence, and >apparently inappropriate or tasteless responses to shocking >situations (laughing at corpses, for example). These are all >coping strategies developed by people who desperately need >coping strategies. While I agree, based mainly on what I've read (though going to an awful lot of HIV meetings, perhaps one meets a similar kind of stress), most of this is rarely or never seen on screen... We see sarcasm and emotional silence, but very little of the rest. Certainly less crude/tasteless than your average office, a lot less language too. (In fact, one of the obvious differentiating factors between my 'real Tavia MS' and the B7 characters in my piece is the swearwords-to-content ratio.) Tavia PS The repetition of food in Patricia Cornwell is almost certainly (IMO) coincidental, everything in those novels repeats, as one realises if one reads several of them back to back.

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Re [B7L] fanfic
by Tavia Chalcraft 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

Neil: >Reprographic characterisation was mentioned by Tavia >(who in turn was apparently citing me). 'How many ways back' by Neil Faulkner (on Judith's site). An excellent essay, Neil... >I've generally >taken this to be the writer saying,"Look how well I can >write the characters" - an act of appropriation. (At the >same time, stories written in this way can read like >applications for some kind of Brownie Badge. >Fan Writer Assignment 2: Write no more than >three hundred words capturing the essential qualities of each >of the main characters in Season X and exposing >the primary manner in which each character interacts with >the other. All lines of dialogue must be accompanied by a >suitable adverb. Each character must be referred to >by a binomial descriptive eg Burly Rebel, Snarly Tech, >Little Thief etc. At least one incident from a broadcast >episode must be explicitly referred to.) All characters must be presented in a positive light. All characters must be involved in the action. >'Good' writing, on the other hand, is IMO about sharing a vision with the >readers, not imposing one on them. 'Good' prose should give the readers >enough material for them to construct something that is not entirely their >own and not entirely the writer's. Writers should therefore be >prepared to restrain themselves when it comes to description, >exposition and dialogue. Agreed. Though it's easy to go too far and get faceless people operating in a vacuum again. (Though maybe that's what the story demands...) Tavia

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Re: [B7L] liking 'character'
by Tavia Chalcraft 15 Feb '01

15 Feb '01

Annie wrote: >I think this is more an indication of the differences in "male" >and "female" viewers than anything else. Yes, females >can like the action and the science and yes, the males >can like the character interaction... but I think you still >find that men tend to like one more than the other (on >the whole) and that women go for the character interaction, >the *emotions*, more than the action. This is one reason that >media fandom, overall, and most fan fiction writers in media >fandom, tend to be female. I had to take a walk round the block after reading this (large block). Considering the set of human beings, I think the spread of characteristics overlap more than they diverge between sexes. That is, if you want to characterise a human being, you're better of saying 'they like B7, they like cheese, they are interested in characters...' than saying they are male or female. I find generalisations like the above somewhat frightening. Tavia

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Blakes7 February 2001